Transcript: GM Farcaster ep228 Monday March 24, 2025 with @ phil @ ampsfun

did you

farcaster

choreography of merriman choreography of merriman

at the bank

so i

yeah

how are you

good thanks for the the green room you guys have champagne in there no one told me that

you're through the listing just curious todd i love i love when people ask this $1.29

it was a it was a funny story someone came into the the bright moments gallery in venice when we first started minting crypto venetians and was like hey there's a startup down the street on abbott kinney and it's like a new crypto social network but just to let you know it's pretty sketchy you have to like download a dmv file and put it on your computer i'll say yeah sure sounds fine never met the guy no problem and so

that's the worst that could happen pretty sure dan still has on my keystrokes for like the last four years so

yeah the the venice the venice cabal

now i have three dennis fomo now that woj is there and is just like living his best life in los angeles i feel just incredible fomo every weekend when they're like going on hikes and stuff so

i we we moved up to the bay area my wife and i a couple months ago and so like it's one of those things where when you're in venice you're like oh it's kinda grimy here and like you know and then you leave and you like romanticize it so

yeah it it's sort of like living next to an amusement park like everyone comes and loves it and then you're the one that has to like listen to the ride every day so

sure when man when was it maybe 2017 my friend and i were playing around with ethereum and we decided to start an ethereum mining company out of texas just because the the power was cheaper there and so we ran that company for a few years just as like a a way to learn about ethereum to run a node do a little bit of mining before it switched to to proof of stake and shortly before the pandemic you know the the mining devices don't have that long of a life they sort of burn out because you just run them all the time and so it got shipped back to to where i was living in los angeles and i headed at home for about one day and it's so loud and my wife at the time she was like get this out of my girlfriend at the time she was like get this thing out of the house every time you plug it in it sounds like a buzz saw is going so i i took it to a local like hardware hacking warehouse place and so i would go there to like tinker with it and work on it and i met seth who had just moved to the area and was you know talking to different people that were sort of in crypto and mentioning that he had this idea for an nft gallery and so i kind of felt like oh you know interesting guy but i meet a lot of like sort of crazy people in venice with like vague ambitions and actually the next day in fred wilson's newsletter he sent a newsletter about seth he was like hey you know one of my longtime friends is you know minting nfts on foundation and here's his project and i said okay this isn't a coincidence like i met this guy yesterday i've been following fred for years and you know he just mentioned it so like let me actually go reach out so i bought one of saas nfts on foundation it was like a gan model of the sunset that you know photos he had been taken and we started talking and he said hey you know i'm about to get keys to this gallery on windward you should come and let's talk about it like it's happening and so i showed up and the energy was just totally infectious and and sort of that group evolved and grew into bright moments and we started putting on shows for artists on thursday nights and just caught a wave perfectly of you know people being really excited about nfts artists finding new ways to make money and that eventually sort of

timing into this idea of doing this 10 city journey around the world and you know one of the you know nfts there was a lot of good and bad but one of the good things about that entire sort of wave was this idea that nft projects are projects you sort of didn't have to write a white paper and describe how you were gonna change the future it was like hey here's an idea we have let's sell nfts and go execute on the idea and so the the road map that we came up with was a three year journey around the world to create art with people from all these different places and we finished that journey in 2024 and since then i've been working on some some cool new things amps is one of them but that was that's sort of the abridged version of a very sort of wild couple years yeah

yep and then the summer i sort of it was sort of a little bit of a comedown it was sort of like you know we finished this crate we've been sprinting as fast as we could for a couple years and so you know it took a summer to regroup and moved to rome for a little bit sort of like try to see if europe would feel good i am not wired for europe i just am way too like type a to like relax and do that and so

yeah it was you know it's just hard

great for vacation but after about a week and a half i was like losing my mind i was like no how does no no how does anyone get anything done here and the answer is well they don't really yeah yeah it's a great it's a great lifestyle but

i i agree with the sentiment i can't talk about it today but i can talk about it in three days there's a pretty exciting announcement coming up later this week and so all i will say is i think a lot of people have sort of given up on nfts as the you know way to represent digital art and i'm either crazy or right but we're not we haven't quite given up yet so we have a pretty exciting something to share on thursday so maybe we'll come back and talk about that separate time

i actually it's at a framer right now i mean we can do a quick show and tell hold on

so this this is a

this is by an artist named matt deloria and you can't the the video doesn't really do it justice the this collection was minted in london in

of 2022 matt is an amazing artist he's actually making a documentary about generative art and he just fundraised for it through an nft project called bit bit forms matt's like a generational talent if you don't know his stuff you should totally check it out his project meridian is on yes in the blocks playground project and it is whenever people are like you know what's digital art is it just monkey pictures i show them meridian because it's like this amazing amazing project that so many people are like oh wow you know it creates all sort of questions how do you create it with a computer you know what yeah does it work and then there's another piece right here which is on the wall that i won't pull down which is called a hundred print and we actually this collection was selected through a draft pick so that was it was like you know oh cool strong goldy energy it was like you know you would we we put all a hundred pieces on the wall and you purchased a draft pick ticket numbered one through 100 and depending on what number you had you got to choose which one was left on the wall and so i think i was like number 19 and i have i was so nervous because like i knew the one that i wanted but like you know number nine went number 10 went number 11 went and i was like making side deals with people you know i spent some time with them and so that that was a really fun way to have people engage with the collections i

totally

maybe we should work on a field trip out to san francisco love it time comes we'll have something to share so

started working on the idea over christmas it was the holidays and sort of the original background for it was there was a lot of experiments at that time around like anon cast and supercast and like people basically using these accounts to get distribution for ideas that they had and i looked at it and thought like that's interesting like you know people are using these to get distribution because they don't have an account that has a lot of followers but they have a message they wanna get out and so these pseudonymous accounts have a lot of followers and so people are using them and i thought well that's kind of a hacky way to do it like you wouldn't announce a project through pseudocast or through anoncast or supercast but like what if there was a way to sort of get your message out to other people and that sort of led to the spark of this idea of well you know hey there's these building blocks the social graph is open you know the the warplet wasn't quite out at the time but like these sort of microtransactions had just become possible with base and sort of all peanut butter and jelly and we worked on it on and off jeff and i for probably about four weeks to get it to a point where we felt as though it was ready to launch and like the the core of the app was done in a in a couple days but then the rest of it was the polish around it making sure that like the signer flow felt good making sure that it was something that people trusted and then we've been rolling out the ability to purchase engagement to like a very select group of people i think there's like a 50 or a 75 people who have the ability so we're we're sort of trying to learn as we go but that's the origin story

yeah you know every once in a while i'll put out like a public thread or you can just dm me dm my dms are sort of a mess because of the book channel yeah so like if i don't respond it's not personal it's just like i don't see them all and normally what i'll do is someone asks is i'll go and i'll look at your profile and like generally if your profile has some amount of original content on it that's not chilling things i'll add you to the early access group like at this point you know i'm really looking for founders i'm looking for artists and creatives i'm looking for people who do marketing is really the the the core customer and you should have a budget to spend on getting your message out there and like maybe just backing up a little bit like the the

for those who aren't familiar so it's a two sided marketplace that allows users to buy and sell different types of engagement right so you can think about all these different actions you can take on farcaster you can reply to things you can like things you can recast things and all of those are valuable because it shares a message to your network to the people that follow you and what we've done with amps is we've allowed you to set a price on that and then set a number you know a certain set of people who can pay that price to get distribution through your network right so if you think about it like a two sided marketplace like uber there's demand and there's supply the demand are people who have a message and they're willing to pay to get it out and the supplier people who have a following and want to you know get paid for that distribution they've built in a way that's recurring and not not zero sum and you know on the supply side a lot of people have tried to help creators earn but you know there's a couple problems one there's not there's it's it's pretty hard to make money off of following you have to like sell a product people who are really good at casting or tweeting like aren't necessarily business or product people they don't wanna sell like a package good they don't wanna like have a website they just wanna like do what they're doing and and earn from it and then the the other way to make money if you have a big following is to like launch a coin and like that works once and then no one ever buys anything from you ever again and so it's like okay what you know there's not really a great solution here and so basically as as someone with a a following doesn't have to be big it just has to be passionate you can register for amps and if somebody decides that they wanna get the message out to your followers they can pay you your fee you earn you know essentially passive income

yeah yeah

yeah

we we should talk about that we should talk about that admin

for sure there's always there's always three versions of of a product right and so i sort of have to remind myself okay so there's the there's like the sort of nebulous long term vision of the product that like you know what it could be you imagine it really big at scale it's beautiful everything works it's amazing that's like the far off version that's what it starts with and then there's the version of things that you've actually like sat down and designed and thought of and then there's what actually exists and so like what you're describing is something that's in that middle like we've sat down we've designed it we've thought of it but it hasn't been a priority to build yet but like we have a ton of ideas around how you can actually segment people who follow you who you can recast you you can pay to have them recast by exactly those criteria hey anyone who's earned warp cast rewards that probably is a pretty good signal hey if their nanar score is above the certain amount hey if they're an active member or have a streak in this channel and then you know the amazing thing with a lot of the ai technology is you can actually be really nebulous you can say like people who i don't know post about dogs and like there's you can have a pretty good way to

yeah yeah exactly right

only dogs and so yeah it's gonna be i'm i'm really excited because there's people who have you know 10 or 15,000 really quality followers and we wanna find a way to elevate them in the rankings so you you know they get paid more the the message reaches the right people i think that's gonna be the key to unlocking more demand

for sure

for sure so i see you know a big part of my job is is being a referee and we have to design the system but we also have to make sure that the balance doesn't tip in one direction more than the other so there's supply and demand on the demand side if someone buying engagement i want you know i'm like whatever you know nineties republican i want no regulation i want to do whatever i want like you know what i mean i don't want any restrictions whatsoever but on the supply side i want to approve everything i cast i wanna make as much money as possible from it you know i only i want to be limited to a certain audience so like our job is to balance those two because if you tip towards one side or the other the system doesn't work for anybody and so when we launched the product the first the first you know hypothesis that we had to test was will people actually sign up on the supply side are there actually you know a large enough number of people in the network that are highly connected that will give us the permission to take you know actions from their account and we answered that in a few days you know we had over 12,000 people sign up within the first seventy two hours and that was like a oh shit moment like i think this is gonna work and then on the demand side the question was will peep will people actually pay for this and i think we validated that hypothesis as well we just crossed $10,000 in volume that people have paid to users right and so that's real money that's not like speculative i'm not buying it because i think i'm gonna you know have some asset that's gonna go up in value like i've spent money to purchase a product which is distribution and so both of those things feel really good yeah exactly

that's great you know it took it took just under a month to do it and so you know now it's this teeter totter so demand was going really well there's a bunch of people buying amps and then we started to realize hey as this scales what do we need to put in place so the supply of the network the people who have given access to their profiles we can't lose trust we need to make sure that people still feel really good about doing this so we put a few things in place one only people who you follow so people whose content you've chosen to see can buy engagement from you and that's a pretty good heuristic but it's not perfect i might follow people because they're funny and they're sort of abrasive but it doesn't necessarily mean i wanna share their content to my followers so it's it's not a perfect measure the second thing that we did was we put in place like basically a filter and we have some rules that we've given to an llm which is a moderation bot that says hey here's the types of content we're not gonna allow no bullying no financial scams no outright grifting like all of these things where it's like just that you know just don't

want on your profile but you have no right to get you know distribution through other people and that works pretty well but then there's sometimes it's like it it it's like it doesn't you know it passes the filter but it's still not something you'd wanna post about right maybe it's like hey i love cigarettes and you're like a never smoker okay you can actually put restrict certain people from even without following them without unfollowing them and say hey this person like i think they're funny but like i don't wanna see any of their content posted from my profile i'm just gonna add them to the restriction list and so i think those three things together have layered pretty well and it's not perfect there's still things that sneak through there's still things we know we need to fix before we open it to the general public but i felt pretty good from the reaction that i've seen from people and the thing that we look for is like hey are people deregistering are people actually actively delisting their profiles and that's the key message that we look at to say is the balance tipping right price is another factor if people are raising their prices too high then it doesn't the network doesn't work it's not you know an efficient market

i think the thing that we still need you know my focus right now is on demand i wanna be able to have this product available to the general public you know i don't generally like wait list they feel sort of not egalitarian like people get confused and so i think you know i wanna make sure that we can continue to drive volume and make sure that people are buying engagement and that people are getting paid for it and we made a big step last week which was rolling out likes so now in addition to recast you can purchase like and so they they serve two different purposes recasts are a form of distribution to an audience likes are a way to you know get engagement on a post you know make people look

but but likes are also lower stakes because they don't boost it to your audience in the same way that a recast does and so they're cheaper we set a flat price for likes by default for 50¢ and so you know my plan is we wanna make likes open to the general public right so those three restrictions will still apply you need to follow someone it needs to pass a filter you can restrict anyone you want but i think we can make likes broadly available while we still tinker with recast right so i think that's gonna be a priority to to get demand you know

so i

if you are on the you know early access beta program for the demand side you have access to the full app and so you can go in you can find a cache you can click the heart button and you can buy batches of likes we sell like five ten 20 five and 50 or something like that

and so that's been you know something we've been we've been working on and then just making it easier for people to see you know what they're recasting finding people like that like giving you like fine grain because people people buy engagement once but if they don't see a return on their investment they won't come back and so we have to continue to demonstrate value by saying hey this can help you reach the right audience we got a really nice testimonial from i actually don't know how to say his name out loud anti antimo yeah antimo right antimo antimo fm yes antimo yeah he he spent a couple hundred bucks to amp his cast and then signed a client for like a few thousand dollars and so like the return on his investment was like 10 times which is great yeah and that's the sort of success story that like hey this is working we wanna continue to enable these things and that felt really good

for sure

we we have we have some features internally that are just you know i call them the boro dutch or the goldie features where they're they're specifically features that i've had to build for certain people that's what we that's what we wanted this phase like you know i like if everyone that we invited into the early access buying group was a boy scout or a girl scout we wouldn't learn anything and so i appreciate there are certain people who will find the line and they'll go sit right on the line yep and so our job as a referee is to say where's that line if i don't blame people for sitting on the line that's the way the system is set up we have the ability to move that line and so that's sort of what we're learning is like okay what's kosher what's not what is certain people have things that they're you know more open to than others and so it's been a really good learning experience

yeah exactly

yeah yeah right

for sure and it's been for chaos it's been funny too because i'll see things and i'm like oh my god like what i would never think in a million years to do that or like you know we'll watch people use a product and it's like where are you clicking what are you doing like i've never and so it's just there's a difference between that sort of nebulous thing that's in your mind and what actually gets built and so trying to iterate really quickly you know the frame standard has been pretty good to work with there's a little rough edges on the developer experience but the warpcast team has been incredibly responsive especially over the last few weeks having linda come on board has been just such an absolute huge changer and i've worked with kartik before and he's like he was our like secret weapon at opensea because we he used to work at opensea and like you would request and kartik would fix it instantly and so having him on the work cast team is such a big level up in a bunch of ways that i'm just

yeah

so it's really special to this yeah

yeah it's been it's been really it's been really encouraging obviously anytime you have an idea you want to have it succeed you wanna have people do it and just like the fact that our incentives are aligned with helping our users make money is a really energizing thing to be optimizing for you can sort of like optimize for anything in life and i think that you know this is something where we immediately see the reward of people getting paid and and feeling really good about it what i will say is if if you're registered and you feel like you know you you aren't earning or you're wondering how some people are i know you shared meredith yeah his profile so why why has he earned so much well he set his price to $1 and he has a lot of followers and so when people sort by price they see him right at the top same with same

i'm the dude right yeah and so there's this and we can do a better job of making this visible but there's sort of like a you know if you charge less you'll make up for it in volume right yeah and so if you're charging 2 or $3 right now try dropping it to a dollar and see if it and see if it helps make up in volume and if you decide hey this is too low a barrier i'd rather charge more and i get paid a fraction of the amount of times when i do get paid it's a big payout that's a totally fine decision there's people that have done that i think jesse's price is a hundred dollars i think maybe 10 johnny mac's is like you know 50 or 25 and so if they only get paid one out of every 25 times they've made the same amount of money right right but that's that's just a barrier where like if you're not earning lower your price to a dollar which is the minimum for a recast see what happens and then from there you can sort of you know

that's with a really small pool of people who are buying too so yeah i know like hey

that's right and and you know as the network grows and as people realize the audience of farcaster is so valuable to get the message out to people with distribution will become an increasingly important part of this ecosystem there's not a way to pay for advertising content on the farcaster network and so if you wanna get your message out

yeah right

yeah but in the client feed and and you know just one more point on it because it's a little bit nuanced you know the coinbase team has mentioned that the the farcaster feed is coming to coinbase right it's gonna come into the wallet and whatever they're gonna call it and so there isn't just gonna be one client so even if like the clients are not really that incentivized to go after an advertising business model because you can't you know it's not as valuable to advertise when it's

and so there's gonna need to be this sort of network first approach to distribution and advertising that is a really exciting really exciting space to be playing in

yeah you can you can pay for recasts which will obviously get the word out or you can buy batches of likes which has the benefit of sending lots of people a notification and so those people who need a notification they're gonna click on it and say oh what is this thing that i just liked that i just got paid for let me go check it out and so like i don't know what it should cost to give to send somebody a notification but right now it costs 50¢ and so if you think if you think that the return on that investment from getting a new viewer is potentially higher than than 50¢ then that is a place where it makes sense to to spend money

and if you know that it works and if you know that the algorithmic feed uses things that you engage with to show you more of it it can make sense as a content creator to have people engaging with your content because then the feed shows them more of it so

yeah

for sure

totally and the the game theory is like if you are going to earn whatever a hundred bucks 50 bucks from warpcast rewards it makes sense to spend you know up to 49 of it to put back into engagement because that's still positive ev for you and so you know i don't wanna say how many people that are on the top of the warpcast rewards are using amps or say that you know there's a ton of credit going to it but it is a it's like a first stage rocket for your cast it gets you launched out into the algorithm and then it helps you pick up organic engagement and so it sort of you know instead of starting with zero likes zero recasts you can give yourself the best chance of having a cash go trending which then puts it in front of more people and so if you think the message that you have is worth spreading then it can make sense

that's right

i'm

can i ask you one one more plug for a a related related product made by a friend of mine and definitely not my alter ego jake has been working on qr it's q r dot fun

cannot confirm or deny

who knows who knows but it is another product that i think is doing something really interesting in terms of attention and distribution and i've just been paying close attention to it i know jake very well almost you know one would say personally and when they get their mind on something they work on it like crazy and so seeing them shift their attention towards qr and just sort of relentlessly make it their focus in the same way they did with base colors has been really cool to watch and so i'm really excited about that project i think we're on day like 14 of the auction or something of 19

yeah you know jake could do a better job of this but essentially it is a token where the image of the token is a qr code that you can scan and every day there's an auction to change where the qr code points to and the auction proceeds have historically gone towards buying token and taking it out of the supply and so it creates this really interesting flywheel where as the market cap grows the value of that image grows which means the auction proceeds grow as the auction proceeds grow more token gets taken out of the supply which removes token from distribution which increases you know the the market cap assuming that demand remains constant you're taking supply out and so it's this really nice feedback loop that they've developed and the auction website is a cool riff on nouns there are some features that i i haven't seen on nouns there's almost like a typing indicator so you can see when people are making bids but the best part by far is just jake's commentary of like being out there in the trenches like tagging people hyping people up it's almost like watching like a sporting event because he's so into it when the auction is ending he'll tag people he'll do live commentary and it's worth bidding on it because during the time where you're the winning bid even if you don't close your website is shown and then you get all your money back and so you can you can essentially buy like an ad slot for free you know through the feed and through the qr code the qr coin

yeah yeah it's really creative it's really innovative it's one of the few coins that i've seen recently that i think is i don't know interesting for a bunch of reasons it doesn't feel like a short term thing it feels like the more that it grow it has a really nice compounding effect in the flywheel which whenever i'm looking you know at a meme coin and determining its interest that's something i look for is it a flash in the pan and is it a game of hot potato or is there some flywheel that's going on that's gonna something interesting

i actually think nfts were a better fundraising mechanism for builders just because like their launch meme coins don't actually give the creator enough of the supply and one of the problems i've had with zuora is like just as a taxable event it's horrible you're receiving rewards in the native token and so like if you're receiving rewards and the token crashes you might actually owe more money than you made which is just a horrible thing in the us and nfts are actually a really nice way because like you earn primary revenue and so i don't know if you saw this

the pendulum will swing will swing so

mhmm

no no thank you to everyone who's registered i know it was taking a risk and giving over a signer key is something that we don't do lately so we definitely are doing our best to be good stewards your network and distribution is the most valuable thing you have on on farcaster and so we do not take the responsibility lately so thanks for everyone who signed up

she does yep okay

xbox live i used to play a game i used to do forge mode on halo three and there was these custom apps you would make and i joined an online community called xforgery and i became a moderator there and wow it was sort of like the things where like nobody knows when you're a dog on the internet and i was like definitely way too young to be in any sort of position of that and because i i was a username no one knew and so that was my first like online community that i was really spending a lot of time on

i really like what's the one at the end of summer is that memorial day or is that labor day

in in los angeles people assume it's warm like miami all the time and it's really not but la does have the benefit of being warm later in the season much better than other places and so i like labor day because of the contrast because when it's getting cold everywhere else in los angeles it's it's the hottest it's gonna be all year and so that's the best holiday because it's always a beach day everywhere else it's sort of like cold and miserable and so there's just a lot of like i look around and i'm like wow this is an amazing place to be and that's that was for the last eight years so first labor day in the bay area we'll see if it holds up

it's got a good tan

morning person

you know i i prefer mountains for a bunch of reasons but i feel just quieter there beaches are hard i love the ocean i love the sea and sailing and but yeah mountains are special

i need i need like a tropical vacation i have been i know i've i've been watching white lotus and so like southeast asia feels like you know yeah it feels i'm feeling the pull

to thailand because of it yeah yeah isn't that funny yeah

man

i prefer concerts i think that there's something special about seeing music performed live that you know really really well sporting event is always you never know what's gonna happen but in a concert there's like that feeling when your favorite song comes on and you yell every word or it's like you know an amazing beat and there's something about being able to i don't know predict and prepare for it that makes the moment that much better yeah nice

good question it would be like a weird genre mixing thing sort of like a zen and the art of motorcycle maintenance where it would be like a travelogue mixed with a diary combined and interweaved with like some sort of philosophical observations

when i have time i'll i'll do it

one of my best friends is is getting married this year and we're doing his bachelor party to go to a liverpool game and so i'll say soccer that's gonna be a blast

correct yeah that was it i could've done soccer

next question i'm not answering i'm not i'm not giving you this today i know

i personally okay so what i do is i cut it and then i eat it with a spoon

and i don't eat the skin so

it's there

that's right

i i'm i'm i'm a man of principles i'm sorry

oh man it was probably something in my feed

it was probably within the last couple days i mean definitely engagement right because i i i used amps this morning and so i mean self plug a little bit of a cop out yeah yeah maybe let me give one let me give one more plug william watkins is an amazing generative artist and had a collection on highlight a few days ago of 50 pieces that are code based and it's an absolutely amazing collection and so if you have some money burning a hole in your wallet and you wanna go buy an amazing piece of artwork go check it out on highlight really good like the first collection i've seen in a while where i was like wow this is special

some cool stuff it's it's better every day

thank you

yeah let me let me maybe give you my like thesis for the bull case for nfts just to put it out there so as an asset class why did nft start with artwork well the you know i i sort i sort of i submit that the reason is because artwork is sort of the the only thing that didn't require any sort of tangible tether to the off chain economy and so it was natural that it started there first because if it's gonna be some abstract representation of value it didn't need to have like it didn't need to tie to a company it didn't need to tie to a product it didn't need to tie to some like off chain commodity and i actually think nfts are like a superset of fungible tokens because with nfts you can create as many as you want you can create a trillion a billion but the fact that it has an extra property means that actually you can sort of put fungible tokens within the category of nfts and right now we think about them as these two separate things but i actually think they're they're pretty similar and so like on the extremes i actually think they come together and i think we're gonna stop making this distinction between nonfungible and fungible and i think it'll be a gradient where it's like how much does the nonfungibility matter all the way on one end there's unique artwork one of ones hey this is literally there's nothing else like this token and then on the other end there might be extremely fungible non fungible tokens where they're essentially the same and people trade them as though they are fungible but you can actually double click and dig in and there may be small differences you can think about dollar bills this way we treat dollar bills as fungible i can give you a dollar you can give me a dollar back doesn't matter to me there's a serial code printed on every dollar bill and so non fungible tokens can be made fungible at large enough sizes but you can't go the other way you can't make a fungible token into a non fungible token because right you

sort of sort of but but there is a different token id and so like maybe maybe the better way to

right right or like or like think about ether right like if i if i send ether to your account and then you send me eth back it's not like a bitcoin where there's a way of saying like oh this specific satoshi is yours and it's mine it's like ether it has an account balance and so you know i i think i think that the value in nfts is these strong bonds that it creates between the holders in a way that you know with fungible tokens you haven't seen the same individual communities form you sort of seen these large conglomerate like hive mind things create but within nfts you sort of get this unique identity and i just think it's such a primal human instinct that like this spectrum is gonna disappear all this tech talk that we do about erc 20 erc seven twenty one is gonna get shoved way down in the stack and only nerds will care about it and the consumer will basically say like well how much does fungibility matter to me and most of the time things that are non fungible can be represented as fungible but when you double click you can actually make that that distinction and so that's where i think it's going i think it's gonna take us a while to get there and we're sort of stuck in this like skeuomorphic we only have what we know and so we copy it and we use words like you know the floppy disk is the save button the fact that you put files in folders on your computer it's like we're just not good at coming up with new concepts and so it might take a long time to get there but i'm super excited about nfts as a format and i think that they will succeed when we stop calling them that that will be the moment where victory achieved no one uses the word nft before and so i'm i'm i'm looking forward to that moment

absolutely

it's it's a spectrum it's a spectrum not dead declaring them not dead and not dead at all looking forward to the you know sort of hegelian synthesis that comes from taking these two things and combining them together so i think it'll happen on farcaster first you know

right

on to the next objective desire adrienne how do

do you feel about punks what's your what's your feeling around them do you have like an emotional state when they get brought up or

you go

but but if punks don't do it for you i'm just i just wanna i wanna dig a little bit is it is it because of the aesthetic or is there like some other aspect to it that that's a good question i'm just i'm just i'm just curious about it's for you adrian

i'm i'm always curious about what makes some people want to own certain collections or not or like why it's not interesting and so maybe it's hard to say why something's not interesting but

but a hundred thousand dollar drip tag sign me up

it's a luxury item right so those those two networks of people are they overlap a lot the fidenza and punk so it makes sense to me that you sort of have an interest in both of those things because i think it's a high like i think about the people that are behind it who's what what's the network that you're joining by buying this token and if that network is a network that you identify with then you want to purchase that token do you have any interest in like fractionalized ownership does that do anything for you

you just

mhmm

yep

yeah

yeah so it's like it's like you're involved with an organization that owns the artwork and so you sort of by proxy you know get to be a part of it

cool

i i will be i will be at farcon i will see you there maybe we can do an in person session or i can stop by the booth and say hi to y'all yep yes we'll probably

sneak preview we are strongly considering hosting a bright moments after party for farcon so stay tuned i will let you know if that pans out but we're working on it

we're actually supporting we're supporting a new gallery that just opened there who's using some of our screens called tender it's run by an amazing guy named adam and a dear friend of mine named pablo and so i can post some information but if you're in new york definitely go check out tender gallery i'd love to yeah we're we're sort of loaning them some technology and software and stuff like that so amazing alright k i gotta run