and we gotta stop gossiping we have to start the show
that's right alright
alright so we'll we'll circle back to to the gossip because we have cassie gassy is coming in about thirty minutes she's gonna be with us at the top of the hour before that we do have some farcaster ish type news i mean i don't wanna get anybody too excited when i say that so i don't mean like you know the news like not the capital d news but just news this is feel like the worst
worst bait i've ever seen
i know marvel at baiting anyway we're gonna get going so let's get some folks in here recast retweet let people know we are live and i'm really excited to chat with cassie we've had some really interesting things going on this week mostly outside of farcaster that have an impact vitalik's got some things to say so we're gonna dive into all of that just on the other side of this i forget how long this one is forty one seconds
welcome to gm farcaster bringing you everything from breaking news to spicy memes to the deep lore shaping this vibrant digital community more than just a show gm farcaster is your digital third space where the community connects the stories unfold and the culture thrives whether you're a daily caster or just dropping by we've got the latest buzz to keep you plugged in so grab your coffee and let's dive in with your hosts manas propp and adrian for another episode of gm farcaster
gm farcaster it is wednesday january 21 and you are here with nonesh professor and adrienne for twenty nine minutes of farcaster news to start your day plus a chat with the cassie hart to chat about quilibrium and quora mobile and i'm very excited about that because i was on quora mobile today just playing around i keep trying to jump into all the different clients and there's just they're getting really good
there's so many really good and i think
because i'm not using them
i know
i feel bad i'm going through i'm going through a little bit of a personal a tumultuous time in my personal life these days that i'm not gonna talk about on the air right now okay but i just want people to give me a little bit
of space and i promise to try them all i feel bad i feel like
i should be the one trying them all and i only just used the dgen app this week alright so so i'm gonna be
and we're gonna have by the way we're gonna have yassica on next week
yes
so to talk about the dgen app and dgen so that'll be happening we have like was it next week or the week sorry yeah it's next week we have so many guests coming on yes adrienne asked you for her privacy at this time while she does not use your client please don't add that
i i you know what i just i feel bad i know i can do better and i'm disappointed in myself and we do have a lot of guests
oh god i just remembered something i just remembered something pine tree team i'm very sorry huey i know you're in my dms and i'm so sorry i forgot to set it up i was supposed to reset our streaming key and everything or oh whatever the rmtp and i forgot i meant to do it right before we went live and and i totally forgot so i'm sorry we'll get it done before friday i apologize it hasn't been working properly so
oh
they reached out and yeah said you need to fix this so anyway so there's multiple streaming clients there's multiple farcaster clients it's a lot it's a lot we're trying we're trying to do
all that under under the premise of farcaster is dead
yes yeah farcaster is clearly dead i have five different clients i tried this morning you know so yeah very dead and they're all very active and they're all very different i this is what i'm enjoying right now is that they're they're all very different like even your feed is different so you see different things you see different people and that to me is really exciting but also the way in which information is presented the focus they all change they're all different so go check them out and we'll dive into some of those in a little bit more but first on the world news before we get to local news everybody's over in switzerland because that's where the illuminati meets this time of year so brian's been welcomed in and this was from decrypt coinbase ceo seeks win win on markets structure bill in davos a charm offensive brian armstrong is set to meet bank ceos a week after coinbase pulled support for the crypto market structure bill they didn't i mean they pulled support they said they can't support it in this form not the whole thing there's just a couple points that they wanted more discussion about and i did watch him on bloomberg as well this is another cast from him just arrived in davos for wef three main goals this week talk to world leader leaders about economic freedom and how crypto can update their financial systems continue the push for market structure legislation without letting tradfi ban their competition keep pushing for tokenization to democratize access to capital markets the future of finance is here and it's time it's built for the people so what i found exciting about this is i saw two things i saw him talking on bloomberg he did a great job by the way look at like go back to brian like even five years ago to brian now he's had some good media training
he's very charming
he's getting there yeah he's much better so there's that but it was really there were moments that were very funny and she was tough on him so i highly recommend watching that bloomberg interview he did but you know he was talking about how you know he only wears a suit when he like is there or he's in washington he's like otherwise he's in his hacker clothes and then there was a panel that he was on and he was talking to folks who were talking about central banks and how they trust the central banks more because they're more decentralized they mentioned decentralized and he went wait wait wait he's like but he said they said something about bitcoin being too centralized centralized or something like that and he was correcting that he's like it is the most decentralized thing he's like no i think they said the people who own bitcoin like the owners of the chain and it was like hold on so there's still a lot of education that needs to be done at that level so i appreciate that you know for whatever
criticism you may have of coinbase and brian and a lot of it is very well placed i appreciate there's somebody in the room at least being able to educate and correct some of those you know solutions that are just don't make any sense so there we go so that's what's happening over there meanwhile moving on also not really in local news but now to national news into the larger crypto sphere we have this from zero x luo who and and this is just a good explanation of this but yesterday mask network it was announced that mask network which is not metamask let's clear that up right now has acquired lens so they are taking over lens network that is no longer under ave and that team over there and stani so this was from zero x well it looks like masq network is acquiring lens it feels like a move toward consolidating resources and focusing on building better products i've talked about this many times it's honestly a shame that so many big lens clients have shut down one by one interesting favor app hey butterfly and now only orb remains plus firefly app as an aggregator so and a lot of like hey and butterfly were also aggregators like you could post there and it would go to farcaster as well mhmm whether it was launching a token memberships or experimenting with other monetization models none of these attempts really prove sustainable in the long run part of the reason is that lens lenses user base was simply too small another is that the ecosystem was incredible it was extremely fragmented different clients didn't interoperate well features weren't shared and users ended up scattered across apps which only made each individual client weaker the reason i'm reading all this is i feel like there's some really good warnings here and good mhmm to like be aware of that's why i think farcaster's product led protocol development makes a lot of sense if mask becomes the new steward of lens there will be finally be an opportunity to consolidate resources across the ecosystem and truly double down on making orb and firefly even better products and perhaps most importantly there's little reason to doubt mask's commitment to the ideals of decentralization maybe one day we'll see farcaster gain a new steward as well there are already some rumors along those lines yeah we'll get to that that's in local news if that happens i wouldn't be surprised and i'll be inclined to believe it for would be for the same reason concentrating resources to build better products attract more users and ultimately help the protocol protocol grow stronger as a whole desos can only go mainstream once there are great products that people genuinely use and the full announcement was over on twitter by the lens team and masq so go take a look at that but i felt like that was a really good review of that and then we had this this morning from vitalik weighing in in 2026 i plan to be fully back to decentralized social if we want a better society we need better mass communication tools we need mass communication tools that surface the best information and arguments and help people find points of agreement we need mass communication tools that serve the user's long term interest not maximize short term engagement there is no simple trick that solves these problems but there is one important place to start more competition decentralization is the way to enable that shared data layer with anyone being able to build their own client on top in fact since the start of the year i've been back to decentralized social already every post i've made this year or read this year i've met or made or read with firefly.social a multi client that covers reading and posting to x lens farcaster and blue sky though blue sky has a 300 character limit so they don't get to see my beautiful long rants
oh yeah i didn't know that about blue sky i actually might be might need to go make my account after hearing that
she loves a short form but crypto social projects have also have often gone the wrong way too often we in crypto think that if you insert a speculative coin into something that counts as innovating and moves the world forward mixing money and social is not inherently wrong substack shows that it's possible to create an economy that supports very high quality content but substack is about subscribing to creators not creating price bubbles around them i feel like i've heard this somewhere before anyway over the past decade by creating price bubbles around them and all fail by one rewarding not content quality but preexisting social capital and two the tokens all going to zero after one or two years anyway that long i think he meant days too many people hate galaxy brained arguments that creating new markets and new assets is automatically good because it elicits information when the rest of their product development actions clearly betray that they're not actually interested in maximizing people's ability to benefit from that information that is not hey key in info utopia that is corpo slop shots fired hence decentralized social should be run by people who deeply believe in the social part and are motivated first and foremost by solving the problem of social the aave team has done a great job stewarding lens up to this point i'm excited about what will happen to lens over the next year because i think the new team coming in are people who actually are interested in the social even back when decentralized social space barely existed they were trying to figure out how to do encrypted tweets i plan to post more over there this year i encourage everyone to spend more time on lens forecaster and the broader decentralized social world this year we need to move beyond everyone constantly tweeting inside a single global info war war zone and into a reopened frontier where new and better forms of interaction become possible okay i usually do not read all of vitalik's stats because they're usually like that but i felt like this one was so central to what we've been talking about and what we're gonna talk about today with cassie that it was important to kinda have that full context and i do see you down there cassie gm we'll we'll we'll be bringing you up in about fifteen minutes we've got a few more things to talk about but it's been that was really good to read and to kind of get his thinking right now some folks were like well it's because his friends you know are now taking over lens i'm like no he's been doing this the whole time
it's all there so it was i was i was i was happy to see that any thoughts on those two things on that
bunch of eyebrows that has dropped no i love to see it and it reminded me also kind of of what brought me to farcaster from the beginning as well mhmm i also had a thought because i wrote a cast about being how i also find myself deeply prosocial and then i realized i think the word social is gonna get starting to get thrown around and it doesn't really mean anything and it probably requires some clarity of like what do we mean by social
well what do you mean by social
yes well i started writing that cast and i realized i hadn't been able to articulate it so don't ask me i mean i think it has to do a lot with
yeah i i actually am not gonna answer that right
now okay
because i when i think about have the thoughts but it's
yeah and i don't know i don't know if i fully have a fully formed thought on this either but here's here's my thinking i think there's a big difference between social media and social network which we've said before yes it's exactly what we mean yes to crypto by social we mean twenty four seven trading absolutely with your friends that makes it social i do kinda mean that though i actually do but i'll i'll circle back to that but i think a social network is very different from social media and i think sometimes those two get equated as the same and i think that's very i think you have to think of those a little differently but also i do think there is a place for socialfi and i don't think it's going anywhere and i think it makes perfect sense because if you are excited about something and you wanna share it with your friends and it might require money of some sort like it's gonna it's gonna happen so it's gonna happen one way or another it's just a matter of how we do it is it in a group chat on telegram or is it you know out in the open publicly and i'd like to see more of that so i think it's still you know i've heard this like oh social five is dead i'm like it's just getting started you people are absolutely you know batch of crazy and all you have to do is watch what pump is doing and watch what robinhood is planning and you know go beyond like what we see in our little bubble so anyway yeah
i mean so much of the social but like even this talk it's just it's so narrow to forecast during crypto and i'm like what i'm trying to get at is what social means in a really broader sense of of humanity so like technology aside
yeah
what's a society it's like a lot about how do people collaborate together to create mutually beneficial systems so like in your low like thinking really really small and then
sounds like a damn
created a internet created a place where the world can talk to each other yeah and that's great because you can find like minded people from all over the world
and you know we've talked a lot about our kind of past like i have loved social networks i've met so many yeah people and have gotten so many good opportunities and then there's like the flip side of why social media is the worst thing that's ever happened so my general thought and why i was attracted to forecaster was because i don't think any one person can solve it
yes i agree with that
so so like any
and that's why i'm really enjoying this moment where we have so many different clients that are really well thought out and have a point of view it's not just like an exact replica and i did you see chris crow created i didn't pull it the philosophical foxes post that he did and what how he's thinking about sofa and it was like it was you so right social media sucks long live social media exactly links exactly
alright let's do a couple more things and we can get cassie up here who we definitely wanna talk to about all of this and how she's thinking meanwhile
this was funny farcaster this is adam farcaster pivoting from social become primarily wallet focus metamask acquiring lens to become more social focused again not metamask but if it were great but if it were also that would make an expense but it's not i did think i think phantom mentioned they were adding social to it as well but i loved this from nikki sapp this is perfect schrodinger's app everyone's anxious because the team is quiet so we've used our critical thinking skills so it's pretty clear what's happening is some kind of acquisition merger or something obviously which means they're probably in some kind of legal due diligence time period quiet period where you can't talk about it so everyone just chill just chill you're getting crazy absolutely crazy so it's been
but that's not fun if you just don't talk about it
it's so and by the way
that is a likely that is a probable likely scenario likely more than others yeah but it is not the guaranteed only scenario there could be other scenarios that we that have maybe i mean this is why prediction markets are fun right
yeah exactly i get it and and they're also social i have no chill i know cassie
that's right
but that's actually part of your part of your charm it's different this is remarks between between the lines folks quoting quote in twr saying american public schools under teach the physics of weather like what where are your employees talk to me
meanwhile is everybody getting ready for this weather pattern coming across yeah
i know
the us today and all i have to say and i know completely off topic and you're gonna kill me because we're already behind schedule
because and i'm and i live in florida
all i saw yesterday was like twitter all over being like massive storm coming and i just wanna say i didn't trust it because twitter turned into rage bait and i'm like is this real or are you just trying to kind of like
it's real
engagement bait me
and jim cantore is your friend
and all i have to say is that's the problem with trust when you lose when you lose someone's trust it's really really hard to get it back and that's what you've done to me twitter i don't believe anything you say anymore anyway yeah go stock up your fridges people and get some firewood alright yeah back to forecaster news back to local news and weather
back to thank you that was our wet thank you for that weather report adrian now back to local news
but yeah it is gonna be bad out there so be careful and and also because it's hitting some of the south and midwest it doesn't get that kind of weather and that's the big problem
right
follow jim cantore he's he's trustworthy he's but also if he shows up in your area you should have already left i've been in that situation you're too late you should have already left okay moving on and then this was from dsa what if markle is quiet because they're acquiring the only base sequencer did think that was funny there's been a lot of chatter about base having just one sequencer oh and this from seb zapper so binance is buying firecaster that was the first time i heard that one mentioned specifically so that would be the least likely scenario i've ever heard so i think about her
lower likelihood but not really that one's pretty much
no i think that would that would pretty much be at the top of the list in my mind based on who who the founders are and finances i'm no no definitely not i made an attempt to calm things by saying this sometimes people are quiet because they're legally have to be until then keep calm and carry on it backfired
it really backfired so then i casted this as a shitpost so the keep calm and carry on didn't take and speculation ramped up streisand effect style so how about this and i asked you all to please read it with my little you know whimsical emojis in mind maybe what they're really doing is getting ready to lodge a farcaster token and they're going to launch it on clanker and they're going to use quotient so only those who cast quality content not written by ai or bots that contribute to conversational liquidity will be rewarded so you all should really work hard to cast really good content until instructed otherwise so that we have better things to talk about and i did add a disclaimer because y'all are crazy that this is not financial advice not legal advice and i know nothing and it should be taken as a shitpost and also there is no token i love you there is no token we love you but also i know
but it could but it could be
but what happened was i noticed yesterday was all of a sudden people started back hosting a lot better quality content i don't think there's causation here but i'm not sure so if any of you took that like as like gospel there is no token but also keep doing it because i appreciate the better quality content so you know whatever gets you there works for me
but if no the question is why
i think we need to not prey on people's desperation and hope for no there's no token to rain from the sky
there's no token but it
is fun to store gossip i don't know a week ago i was like well i'm not asking fine yeah i love how i've completely turned it only took a week but a week ago i was like we're gonna be above this we're not doing gossip we're not starting rumors and after a week of silence i'm like no it's kinda fun
when i post the first thing of like oh they're being quiet maybe because they legally have to be i had dms from people i was like i know nothing zero i'm using critical thinking skills we had these back in the eighties it's something what would you like like that's it i know nothing i have no real information but you guys should definitely tune in to gm farcaster all the time because we will definitely have the information when we have it this from matt lee and i thought this was hilarious history will remember how you acted during the great merkel silence of twenty twenty six
no it won't
there's no such thing as memories anymore everything is forgotten within twenty four hours that's true
and then did you see this post from six that broke everyone's brains
yes of course of course i did
yeah
i can't i'm not even gonna read it because it it's nonsensical words where everybody including me and the replies are going what are you saying and it was just i don't know what he was doing but logan ought
he was word salting
he was word salting
you remember like the thing people used to do with the autocorrect like you'd start typing a sentence and you only complete it based on the words that come up in your
oh and that's what he did that would make sense
i don't know if that's what he did but that's what it sounded like it's like just a bunch of words like what
are you doing and i like this from logan alex i'll take things e e cummings might write if you were a crypto bro having a stroke for 500 it's like yeah that's what it sounded like but go check that out because it was pretty funny okay couple more things from our builders whoops whoops whoops whoops whoops couple more things from builders whoops maybe maybe maybe this was from our winner of our auction so we are now doing an auction with late night on base for our opportunity to share a cast on the show and we do reserve the right to refuse if it's something too scammy too crazy too whatever i had a little pause on this one i gotta tell you so i i did i did some digging to make sure we knew who the team was and we did so that was cool so they said hey can you tell us who's the team behind the project and one of them was 0x mentalist who was if you guys were at for anyone who was at base camp was the illusionist i guess i'll call them who made jesse appear and it was very cool anyway this is called lottery lottery is the first limited loss lottery experiment we put lotteries on a bonding curve so you can trade them while trying to win the pot this video takes you through everything you need to know we're clanking our platform token lottery today it looks like the first daily lottery goes live on lottery.pawn mini app at 09:30pm four hours after launch may luck forever be in your favor i am going to nfa the heck out of this well i you know know very little i do the team they did list who the team members are you can go check that out in this in the thread that we're gonna put in the show notes so that you can make your own decision here but very you know excited to see some builders building something cool and i do like the little logo because it's cute it's a cute little thing so there you go and thanks for bidding and we'll have another auction up for friday up soon and we usually started in the 20 dish dollar range in various tokens today today's was in habs so the haberdashery sponsors us on wednesdays so our wednesday auctions will be in haves moving on couple more things thank you quotient i just i was able to claim about 50 something dollars and better from the quotient leaderboard i love this leaderboard it is my favorite leaderboard so it is my new favorite leaderboard and i ended up at number four this week and i love that so the next week over this next week the leaderboard rewards featuring over $900 in minted merch presented by minted merch are now live the top 50 performers will split rewards when the campaign concludes next tuesday take 25 in minted merch to unlock two x reward boost make sure to add the leaderboard mini app to be eligible for rewards also if you look through the leaderboard i'm like this feels like good quality i feel like it's picking up i mean i might be a tad biased but i feel like it's picking up like where we had previous problems with leaderboards where you could feel it was very much gamed by people you'd never heard of this feels a little bit more like it's hitting the right notes so thank you ruminations and quotient this from kenny hey grock what was the coolest thing accomplished by a dao in the last year and this was about the dgen dao and dgen doing the amazing
guinness book of world records for the most kickflips in one minute so that was pretty cool and that was in response i think related to vatalik's other cast about we need more daos and that was very cool and again today is sponsored by the haberdashery which is also dejenna so thank you to them they're doing cool stuff this from deployer rolling out daily bets right on the timeline powered by polymarket you all you have to do is comment on the threads in if you are a banker club holder you can play around with this over on twitter to help deployer test it out but something kind of fun new and it's really just like is eth going up and down is solana going up and down and they're doing some testing right now so go check that out
this from oops real genuine moe i think it is is it real gen or it's moe sonaar is now a full farcaster client another client with farcaster and base apps prioritizing tokens and trading there's a need for more social and content focused clients sonar gives you a clean interface to experience protocol prioritizing content media and discovery sign with farcaster account to check your following feed notifications and interact with post media gallery for views users and channels custom pin feeds coming soon global ban list for spammy accounts historical posting stats for users global farcaster stats fully open source and so check it out and see how it is i have not checked this one out yet this one is new so there's only so many so many things i can do lastly or i think this is lastly maybe yes before i get over to cassie rainbow it's official we're taking a snapshot for the rnbw airdrop on monday january 26 at 04:20 of course mike demeris is picking 04:20 pm eastern you still have a chance to accumulate rainbow points before the rainbow airdrop on february 5 and this is different they set this up very differently so if you're not paying attention to this like it has like a weird mechanic where there's a little bit of i don't wanna say the word equity but kinda involved and it's it's really there's a foundation that's holding a month is gonna be holding some of the tokens so it's just kind of a different approach here and very interesting
all right adrianne did i miss anything before we jump in to chat with cassie i'm very excited
you ready yeah
let's pray oh one more thing i forgot one more thing one more quick thing we have a new website go check it out oh gmforecaster.com adrienne spent a lot of time on it and it's very cool and i like it a lot and she did a great job so go check it out lots of cool stuff here
actually i didn't spend a lot of time on it because ai is amazing and was able to get this done in a few days
oh you still did it's very cool so go check that out and we're gonna bring up cassie and we're gonna be talking about core mobile wallet we're gonna be talking about equilibrium if you haven't checked this out yet you're gonna learn lots more right now so without further ado let's bring her up welcome cassie hart to gm farcaster i'm so excited to have you here
i'm excited to be here it's been a long time coming i know you guys have wanted me on for a bit but the schedule's been rough and i usually am not awake this early
well we appreciate you and this is us doing a later show which is the bigger part it it's amazing to have you here we did get a chance to chat with you at farcon last year but that was before you had core mobile that was before a lot of a lot of the stuff that you've you've done over the past almost a year probably nine months or so so where should we start here adrianne should we start with should we start with what is quilibrium qu quillibrium or how to say it or you wanna start with quorum mobile where do you wanna start
either one
you pick
let's start with cool equilibrium alright and yeah because i feel like that's a nice foundation
setting the foundation yeah okay let's start there
onto core
so i'll i'll give you like a really like rapid fire history about eight years ago at this point i was working on a stream that was basically just teaching people how to code obviously this is before we all got ai teachers that could tell us basically everything we wanted to know but back in those days people had to code by hand and at that time a lot of people had questions like hey how do i build applications like somebody would who's working at a you know senior senior staff etcetera level at facebook or amazon etcetera and so i was running the stream teaching people how to build applications at that kind of scale basically like how can you handle millions of simultaneous users how do you architect an application in that way and i like to do things by example because example is generally the best way to learn and so i was building out this a couple of different examples but eventually it settled on something that was kind of like discord and at the time discord was going through some interesting social crises two different things one there was rumors of an acquisition which sounds kind of familiar right now and is kinda funny but the other is that they were actively suppressing a community specifically the wallstreetbets subreddit had gotten banned from discord and they were banned because they used certain terms linguistically that didn't align with everyone and it caused a lot of conflict and strife because like these people didn't mean anything that was actually like awful by it they weren't attacking others like they were calling each other certain things that don't tend to fly on most broadcast but that was just an in group terminology and it really struck a chord with me because the idea of a social platform deciding to be an arbiter of speech is generally it's something that doesn't rub me the right way because speech you know it has different in every single culture there's a different meaning of potentially even the same words but also the idea that one company in one small portion of the world getting to dictate how others speak is patently absurd to me and so the example that i was diving into by building a new discord was what if we had a way to you know affect the levers of control such that we didn't have to worry about that and so the first thing obviously is your easiest way to solve that is to not be a nuisance to you know the the hosting providers they care about what they're hosting in terms of content and so you have to be the enforcer of that content if you're if you're complying with app store rules which farcasters had it been growing pains with if you are on amazon and the people who are using your app are politically inconvenient they've been known to pull the plug and so first ad encryption okay well turns out that's actually a difficult problem if you look at signal if you look at whatsapp there's always a limit to how many people can join a group and the reason is because the way that they are doing their group message encryption is limited you have to encrypt the same message you're sending to every single member of the group and that's computationally expensive so they cap it at a thousand call a day but i've been working in cryptography for a very long time at this point i've been doing novel cryptosystems for productionized purposes of various kinds and eventually through this whole process i was also working at coinbase and at coinbase i was getting the mobile retail app to work with our mpc tech and mpc stands for multiparty computation and the purpose of that at coinbase was to make the web three wallet that they put in the retail app for about a year and then canceled because that seems to be coinbase's mo is to launch a product and then rug it after about a year and what what i learned from that experience there is that mvc is a very powerful tool it can actually let you do a lot of things that normally you didn't think you could with multiple people at the same time and so by consequence i adapted the mvc approach to group chats i created a new encryption mechanism for group chats called triple ratchet which is an extension of signals double ratchet algorithm and the idea was to change how the back and forth conversation pattern worked so that you didn't actually have to encrypt the message to each and every user okay great came up with that turns out signal also now created a new algorithm they're calling triple ratchet totally unrelated and
starling should've should've trademarked it
yeah simple simple search would've told them but they're not the ones who created it they created double ratchet so
wait okay i was like
i think i cannot interrupt you and just let you talk for an hour
i totally could yeah loving this loving every minute of this
yeah this is can i pause for one sec and is there a way to
explain to like a you know at the level of like a smart high schooler i like that was always like the difference between like what triple ratchet is in terms of the mechanism like this is the first time i've heard either you or anyone describe kind of the limits of what makes encryption hard and it kinda makes sense that you have to do kind of the end to end for when you have a group message is there a way to yeah like high level explain
yeah so they use the term ratchet to refer to
hold on i need to pause you guys right now because i didn't think i thought the chat was trolling us but they're not nanar is acquiring farcaster dwr just said no i'm not i'm like yeah i'm like i'm sorry i need to just we need a one small pivot because i did it
breaking news
yeah like we literally have breaking news dan we told you to come on when you were gonna do this but we i feel like we need to just pause for a second because then i have some questions for you cassie around that because i'd like to understand it holy crap we have rish coming on friday i hope still but let me just grab this cast from dan i saw everyone posting it in the chat and i honestly thought they were full of crap so i needed to go check so but i wanna circle back because i'm really loving everything she's talking about and now i have to pause okay so let's read this from dan real quick and see what it means nanar is acquiring farcaster over the next few weeks we'll transfer ownership of the protocol contracts and code repositories the farcaster app and clankr to nanar they will run and maintain everything going forward some members of the merkel team broon and i will step back from day to day work on farcaster and move on to something new okay this is making a lot of sense rish manan and the rest of the neynar team have been building on farcaster from the start neynar was one of the first farcaster clients and its infrastructure now powers much of the developer ecosystem we think they are the right people to take over leadership of farcaster and they'll share their new builder focused vision soon this wasn't an easy decision farcaster and the people building on it mean a lot to us we're proud of what our team built and what the community built alongside us but after five years it's clear farcaster needs a new approach and leadership to reach its full potential we're excited to see what farcaster becomes under neynar and we're looking forward to this next chapter okay
did not have that on our no no autocracy theories
i actually did but i didn't say it i'm not neymar but i i was thinking that things might get split so in other words that annembrooke might go off and do something else and i think it's still stripe i'm gonna be honest but i'm not positive and i have no information about that but we'll see but it might be over there that wouldn't surprise me and then that the protocol might go somewhere else because that's actually one of the things i was going to ask cassie about was if that happened how does the protocol itself you know continue without you know if the team decided to go somewhere else would you know how how would they do that from a technical perspective to at least continue the protocol so anyway cassie thoughts on this
i'm gonna i'm gonna love a spicy question grenade out into the computer
i'll
be curious to hear what rich has to say on friday but at least for dan and varun i'm kinda curious what what happened to we're working on this for the next ten years
that's a good question that's an excellent excellent excellent question we'll try and get that answer for you clip that
we can tell our little ai thing it's a clip thing
what's the clip
yeah yeah so anyway one second while i jump into rish's dms to confirm he's still coming on friday he might be like yeah no really hope he still is anyway okay so i don't even know what to do here let's let's reset there's not much more we can talk about there we assume that we're still gonna have rish on friday we'll have a lot of questions for him then we'll hopefully they'll have some you know answers being produced but at least we have we know what's going on so we can stop the eternal speculation and also did nobody put a poly market up i mean come on poly market you just really let us down on that okay backing up just a little bit to equilibrium where were we you were at coinbase we were talking about you were building a thing also by the way you are really good at explaining this because i i was really following along we were at triple ratchet that's where we were okay continue
so the the core concept behind a what's called a cryptographic ratchet which i believe was actually a term that moxie marlinspike the the original creator of signal i think he came up with the term but you know like a base basic ratchet you use a ratchet you can only rotate it one direction when you push it backwards you're not actually pushing it backwards you're just getting more leverage it only iterates the direction that it's configured to go in the same way a cryptographic ratchet works it does the same thing every single step that you do every message that you send is advancing that ratchet forward in a way that the keys being generated with each call changes with every step and that's a really powerful tool because when you look at like classical cryptography like just basic like you know we we agree to some sort of key whether it's a password or whatever it's the same key every single time so if somebody were to for example they were they were snooping on your conversations and through some special kind of attack maybe they gained access to your system maybe they found a flaw in the way that keys were being generated whatever it is the moment they have that key all messages past and present are now decryptable by the attacker and so the purpose of a cryptographic ratchet is that it's constantly generating new key material and each side is contributing their own key material so that the key used to encrypt the conversation is always moving that way if an attacker were to break in through a side channel they might be able to get a message or two but they're not gonna be able to get the past and future conversation
okay is it is it necessarily then ephemeral like if meaning you know like if if if we've been communicating using this and i'm kind of am i able to go back to past messages and decode them like and see those
the trick with that that you know systems like signal use they don't there there there's no actual magic there basically your device usually your phone is storing all of the message history and they store it encrypted in a way that you know only when the app is actually live in memory are you able to see all your past messages and that too is also important because in you know for example say that well i mean like i i used to present a hypothetical scenario but we live in truly unprecedented times and so at this point like let's say that you just happen to be involved politically with a group of people that have done nothing illegal whatsoever but now you're you know somebody of interest and so they take your device and they try to read all the messages on it well if it's encrypted at rest they're gonna need the key to access that and most phones these days have what's called a secure enclave built into it and it's basically just like a crypto wallet keeps track of your private keys and is the one responsible for managing it it's responsible at a hardware level to manage the keys that encrypt data that lives on your phone so if the phone is off for example there is no way at least with iphones there is no way for a a even an experienced attacker to extract the keys necessary to decrypt the conversations
beautiful
and so that comes back around to triple ratchet concept because double ratchet advances twice there's two different cryptographic ratchets the first is it advances the key like the core ephemeral key that it in fact uses the same term advances the ephemeral key every time the other side responds so in typical cryptography parlance they use the names alice and bob to refer to two different participants and so alice sends a message advances the the first ratchet bob sends a message advances the first ratchet but at the same time each message sent is advancing a second ratchet that's just iterating that key material from their side forward and so there's a few other little tricks that makes it easy to handle things being sent out of order because obviously if you get a message out of order you need to know which key to apply to it otherwise you won't decrypt anything in fact actually the early days of farcaster we were still trying to get it just right and if you remember sending messages sometimes led to this message could not be encrypted yep yeah that that's what happens if you don't if you don't get it just right on how to handle out of order messages and so the same problem exists for group chats and so the way that signal solved it was to just have a thousand separate double ratchet sessions with all of the users except it's a thousand for you it's you know 1,000 factorial for everyone combined so i came up with triple ratchet to solve that problem basically instead of bob as one of the ratchets it's actually the entire group as a ratchet in a multiparty process simulating who bob is and then from that you don't have to worry so much about the the difficulties of scaling that out to thousands or millions of users and that was the target i had in mind is make this work for a million users within a single chat because my my north star was the names of it in me midjourney the midjourney discord was actually a record breaking discord they had millions of users discord had to do so much engineering work on their back end just to make it even work because there were just so many users sending messages and so that was that was an incredible question to pose as a like streaming or a stream to show people like how do you build at that scale and on top of it how do you build it at scale to work with encrypted messaging but then there's the second problem and the second problem is that say that you become popular say that you become popular very during a very contentious election and this isn't a hypothetical either there was a social media platform that became very popular during the twenty sixteen election they were called parler and obviously like you can you can disagree with like what people were primarily thinking on that platform but the reality is is that most people on any social media platform regardless most people were complying with the law nobody was like saying anything particularly contentious maybe they were speaking their minds maybe they disagreed with certain people that's that's fine that's that's how free speech works you're supposed to be able to speak your mind even if you're saying stupid stuff and so amazon was being pressured because parler was a very hard right leaning social media platform and amazon pulled the plug because they were politically inconvenient and at that time they had just reached their height like they were finally hitting their stride getting a lot of users they were in in news because of how big the platform was growing and it killed them it just completely killed them
completely forgot about that and i forgot about them like honestly i i they've been you know sort of supplanted by different apps so it's it's but i forgot when that happened where amazon pulled the plug but i do remember having some conversations about that like that didn't seem like you can disagree but it didn't seem like the best approach and i think that was another thing that kind of adds to like if you go back in time you don't even think about it but you start to think about decentralized social sort of from those those moments but not really even putting the pieces together they're sort of hanging in the back of your mind and you don't even realize it so really interesting
yeah and it it wasn't even unique to them either at the time there were other social media platforms that were i'm not gonna name them because i've spoken to their founders personally and i don't think they want me to just like say who they are on a live stream but i spoke with a couple of other social media founders that were on the smaller stage at that time because i was posting broadly about what i was building with this with this discord clone and it was resonating with them because the thing that they were coming to the conclusion on is they too were in trouble like they saw what happened with parler they've even potentially gotten a few messages from amazon about like their terms of service policy and how they're like somehow violating it even if they really weren't and so many of these people were coming to me saying yeah amazon's our existential threat if you find a way to solve that we'd love to jump ship and so that was some extreme validation because these people were coming to me i didn't necessarily know them personally and being told that i'm building towards something that can solve a serious problem for them is valuable and it was at that point and i wanna say it was about 2019 when i when i finally had things far enough that i was broadcasting it that i realized i'm actually building something that has value beyond just being a discord clone and as i was trying to solve more and more problems the you know of course the realization hits you like okay amazon's the core problem here how do you solve for hosting on the internet these days without amazon because you know running your own server infrastructure is not just annoying it's expensive machines fail you have to staff people in data centers to to go fix it or you have to pay a data center but then they're the new like lever of control that can be pressured into shutting you down so at the end of the day you need something that works in a decentralized context and i've been in crypto a long time i've been basically there since the beginning i was on the metztal mailing list when the bitcoin white paper came out and so i i got to thinking about like how do i solve this problem with crypto but the problem is crypto crypto sucks like for for scale like it it really sucks you know bitcoin only processes you know single to double digits of transactions a second at best even ethereum was still pretty slow at that time and even now it's like what i think their peak was like 67 transactions per second and you do a lot of trade offs and vitalik's talked about this a lot as well but you do a lot of trade offs with decentralization in order to provide scalability that's why solana is able to do more transactions per second because they're trading off like if you wanna participate as a validator on their network you have to you know spend thousands and thousands of dollars a month on really expensive hardware just to participate and then you also have to deal with like latency problems the fact that their their validators are all lined up in sequence in advance and they're subject to denial of service attacks all these problems okay so crypto has some interesting ideas but the current structure of crypto is not suited to work for that and so
really quick question before you go any further though the l twos and i'm not even gonna talk about the l threes because i don't think we've seen one that's been super successful have that have they it seems like they've helped some of that but i'm sure there are other problems they may have caused so where do you in terms of like where they're at in in that sort of thinking how are they doing for your
l twos are making an interesting trade off like as as was joked earlier even on this broadcast base has a
single sequencer
but not every l two has a single sequencer to the credit of polygon for example although they might contest that they're not an l two but whatever the case there are plenty of other networks that are l twos legitimately that have more than one sequencer however they are still making certain trade offs and the way that they're making that trade off is assuming that by inheriting the security of the l one as they say that that makes it sufficiently decentralized and i really don't like the term sufficiently decentralized it's it's a very strong crutch i i like actual decentralization systems that as as vidal put can survive the walkaway test and the reality is is that no l two at this time can survive the walkaway test and so the the problem has to be solved holistically and so i was looking through like the just sheer volume of research and the the sheer volume of research that came out through crypto is there's a lot of powerful tools that can let you essentially compress a lot of data and a lot of suppositions about that data like you're saying like i have x number of coins i'm spending these coins by sending them to somebody i can basically attest to all of these things using cryptographic proofs rather than actually putting the transaction itself on there and then through some of these schemes for these proofs you can actually compress them altogether into a single statement
let me ask you a quick question in terms of when you're talking about the the research that you're looking at are there certain pieces of research that you've found to be more helpful or that have kind of driven your direction and who is who's doing that research who like who should we be looking at for that kind of information
yeah so this is this is kind of an interesting thing is that like the ethereum foundation has you know they have researchers on staff yeah there's a lot of people who have been nerdsniped by ethereum as a project especially and have contributed their own research their own proposals in fact one great example of this a lot of people have different opinions about mev on whether or not that's a good thing or a bad thing but there's a decent number of people who thinks it's a bad thing and have had given different proposals over the years on how to solve it and so about god i'm gonna get the year wrong on this i swear but around 2020 i think there was a proposal to use this paper called rpm which stands for random permutation mix nets basically just taking a list of transactions and performing this cryptographic shuffle on it that's efficient and the way that that shuffle works produces an output of a series of transactions that everyone can transparently agree to was properly shuffled but it essentially destroys mev because you can't you can't guarantee a sandwich attack can occur you you essentially have dictated that the ordering of the messages is something deterministic but not something that can be interfered with and we actually use rpm we were the first implementation of rpm on equilibrium for our mixed net cool the value prop of rpm however is that or or the value prop of any of these pieces of research however is that they did the research they didn't do the implementation and cryptographers really love to create papers that explain their big ideas
academics too
they probably have like a little bit of a sample code that gives performance values but it's not actually a real implementation it's just doing enough of the work to simulate that implementation so that it can give you numbers that you can confidently show at your paper presentation to say look how fast we are and look what we can achieve but nobody actually implemented it and i did the same thing for rpm like i implemented the paper and got really frustrated because their example was junk but that's basically how it worked i i looked at all these people getting nerd sniped took the best ideas that i could possibly combine and created what has become from it and if you look at it from like a 10,000 foot view you can actually kinda see that it looks like a little bit if you squint it looks like the l one l two l three ecosystem merged into a single protocol because at different tiers of the protocol at the l one level if you will we don't have the the raw statements like the the transactions that are going through we just have proofs about those transactions and then at the l two level you have the actual proofs that are being generated for those transactions and then at the deeper l three level you have the real data that is behind those transactions and so we utilize the techniques that work in crypto to provide privacy work to provide succinct proofs but then we combine it with the research from database development over you know half a century at this point for distributed databases to do the hard heavy lifting of data availability and solving those problems and through that architecture we're able to essentially hallucinate out if you will all the cloud services that exist today so amazon web services their their core offerings of s three which is their file hosting service sns their notification service sqs their queuing service all of their different products we're able to synthesize using this core platform as the basis in which we can provide those but the cool thing is now you don't have to worry about us east one is down it's it's a decentralized product you don't have to worry about a government subpoena shutting you down the network is fully distributed and data is replicated across peers on all geographies you don't have to worry about whether or not the language you speak in particular is something of concern because it might not be in another jurisdiction and at the same time from this you know standpoint of compliance concerns from i mean look ip ipfs has to deal with this people will put things on ipfs that are not great node operators are given the freedom and flexibility to choose what they're replicating as well and so from that entire ecosystem of participants you're able to sufficiently hallucinate out and i i use the term hallucinate specifically because there is an old paper from nick szabo who suggested the idea of what's called a god protocol which is a protocol that's able to essentially hallucinate out all of the different servers of the world you could possibly ever need and from from that you're able to essentially realize any any service that amazon produces roughly and so that's what i've been spending eight years of my life doing and about a year ago i decided to revisit well i guess a year and a couple months i decided to revisit the original proposal what was i building a decentralized discord okay so because i had built out all the tooling necessary to do that on quilibrium i launched quorum a year ago which was a rename it was originally called howler not very important but
i was like quorum what's it been a year i was gonna say okay was named
wow quorum quorum on web has been a been a year quorum mobile was our christmas surprise last year and obviously you know when you're dealing with the app store approval process even for test flight it it gets a little bit delayed so the mobile app didn't actually end up out in people's hands until early january but yeah quora mobile has now been out for i wanna say about two two and a half weeks and it's gotten pretty good adoption and one of the things that we wanted to do with that is to demonstrate how we're able to compose with other protocols and so quoramobile was also a farcaster client and that was that was one of the things that was really important to us because one of the things i found interesting about the farcaster ecosystem and the reason why i stick around here in the way that i do despite not even working for merkel anymore or not necessarily agreeing with the latest pivot to traders
is is that varcaster has one of the most genuine communities that is curious is engaged and is also typically early adopters and they're really excited early adopters and so it's like the perfect storm to launch a product and see and get real feedback from people who will actually tell you without necessarily worrying about like the the mom test issue which is like the people will just give you kind feedback because they think that's what you wanna hear i i have gotten so much really good candid feedback from farcaster on all of the things that i've built that it's it's a very powerful force multiplication for launching products even if there's only 37 of us
yes all 37 are pretty good about giving constructive feedback too and like specific feedback and things like that not just it's great or i hate this or it sucks like well what sucks about it you know like being specific and i do think the other thing i've noticed about you is your lean into creative ways to test things so i got that from the hunger games in the group chat for the moment if if for those who may remember that there'll be very few but also you did something similar with just in at christmas with the hexmus hexmus it was hexmus right the mini app by the way i what are we doing with the reindeer i don't under i still don't know i'm still waiting but that but like can you talk a little bit about that like what exactly were you testing like what is your what was your thinking there because i found that you know very interesting and it was fun to like play around with but like fully understanding like what was what was going on sorta in the background would be interesting
so this is i'm i'm gonna say something kinda controversial but this is kind of one of the problems of crypto is that getting your first users is difficult and so what a lot of teams will do is they'll propose an airdrop in order to obtain their their first users and what you really end up getting is these farms in third world countries of people with like armies of phones at their disposal to to try to simulate actual users this is something that we also kinda noticed at farcaster like a lot of people said oh man there's so many bots on this platform and the reality is that and and varun would contest that he'd say that no they're real users and they are real users but the problem is is that they're also not they they what they're doing is they're operating these farms that are running you know hundreds of phones that have like a single control interface and they will take in like a a post put it through chatchibuty to generate some kind of response that they think might be meaningful and generate 50 variants of it and then go and post it on every single one of those phones so when you look at the data those are real users like in terms of what you measure for realness like it's not world id realness but it's realness and that's the kind of problem that i saw happen even worse once base came on board and there the issue and that's
that's how wow wow was born
when base came on board
yeah this is not a one
of the
most yeah awful thing incredible yeah yes i agree go ahead
because i i worked at coinbase i i know how they operate i know that they talk through every single thing every single outcome and the way in which every user might interpret things so they announced you know we're exploring the idea of a network token and they announced that with no information no information about how they would determine this no information about what they would do and the reality is coinbase is a very highly regulated company and so if they wanted to do an airdrop for example the amount of compliance that they would have to do is so absurd that it's essentially guaranteeing they're not gonna do an airdrop but if they tell people they're exploring the idea of a network token right after they present their social product you're going to get so many people especially from third world countries where they've already built out the the infrastructure to simulate these users they will jump on your product they will juice up your daily active user numbers and it will look like you had a runaway hit product meanwhile you're burying all the users in spam so you've exploited basically third world countries to high like you know essentially hack your user count on something they will never see outcome from and i don't like that
that was really and i kept saying that as well it's like you know just casting i mean just posting on baseapp or just replying non you know nonsensically is not going to get you anything like if there's any kind of airdrop it's going to be tied to actual you know use of the chain not just use of the app but also you're 100% right the like compliance it's gonna it's messy and i was in a session at basecamp with with the attorney like the in house counsel dude and the and it's like they're nowhere close of figuring this out like and they're also not gonna do anything until clarity goes so who was it sorry
was it paul grehewold
no no no it was some for base the baseapp counsel oh okay okay not paul
i was supposed to
say paul paul's too busy he's busy yeah it's good i can't remember his name off the top of my head right now but you know they're thinking about this but they're also thinking about it they're thinking about governance so they're looking at it as a governance token they're so it's gonna be you know if they do it it's gonna be different ben thank you yep that's it
and it was you know interesting to hear that thought process but they're also gonna wait for market structure and clarity act to get any you know before they do anything because it's too much risk so you're 100% on there and it's and by the way so if we use quorum mobile we won't see the cat in our replies meowing or
i should really i should really just like this one time just filter that user out my god
yeah please do at the very moment i think you'll you'll you'll see an influx of very high quality users on core mobile as soon as they get hit with a cat again
yeah no i i don't actually i don't i don't like the idea of silencing users even if they're super obnoxious but what i do believe
is that
people have the right to curate their own feeds and so we do we honor blocks like if you have blocked somebody on the farcaster app we honor that block on on quorum that's not a
that's huge because that's hasn't been the case on some of the other clients so that is huge actually
well there's a there's a reason for that and it's it's kind of it comes back around to the whole decentralized social or sufficiently decentralized social problem and what that essentially amounts to is yes there is a protocol there was hubs and then there was snapchain but at the end of the day the protocol only holds casts reactions recasts the replies and a few other things but it doesn't have blocks and there's a reason for that because you don't wanna publish a block list that would potentially get abused like it does on blue sky but there's there's ways you can do that and still preserve privacy there's no dms on the protocol despite my proposing that two years ago inquorum is basically using that that proposal from two years ago it's just it's just for advancements
why did they choose not to do that was there a was it a was it a financial reason or was it a just a different perspective or was it a building reason so this what do you think i'm just curious
i'm trying to be parliamentary in here
and you're doing very good with it i have to i appreciate it tremendously the
i i respect anne arund a lot like they they are very focused very passionate founders they really like they have an idea in mind and they pursue it ruthlessly and it's great like that that is a kind of drive and focus that is very hard to find and it's no surprise that they were very well capitalized because they've had a long history of doing that but the one thing that i i always disagreed with was they they like to be focused on what is the smallest next step forward that can reach us closer to our goals and that can be a good thing but in a decentralized protocol context that leads to a lot of compromises that you're making that ossify to the point where you know when i was there it was you know 2024 we were talking about okay direct cash on protocol that'll be 2025 and then 2025 okay direct cast on protocol that'll be 2026 and it's it's clear that like when something can't be iterated on a small basis it has to be like a very whole cloth elaborate design in order to make it work that that was not prioritized as much because to be fair when you only have you know tens of thousands or or hundreds of thousands of daily active users you are effectively a science project as dan has said many times and so the problem is you still have to have those those steps forward in actually decentralizing the protocol because otherwise you end up in a state where the protocol is anemic and you have fat clients and fat servers that are making that protocol actually useful this is also the same problem that happens to ethereum there's no built in indexing on ethereum you have to build your own custom indexers for every single application and those types of things are the decisions that informed how we built quilibrium like the way that we store data on the protocol has attached schema that is required it one validates the content coming through conforms to that schema but two essentially gives you the automatic indexing that you need in order to avoid having to have this centralization force of you know infura alchemy etcetera as rpcs and you can see that same kind of design pattern when we released our fork not not like a protocol fork but our fork of the snapchain protocol where hypersnap is essentially a queue powered snapchain node that gives you further indexing and so it's kind of a funny thing like it's interesting that nanar acquired farcaster but when when we forked snapchain we actually exposed all of nanar's apis as like open source apis on hypersnap so you can get nanar for free if you just use a hypersnap node
that seems hard but for those who can for those who are technically inclined
okay wait cassie and
go ahead
i've is hypersnap an extension of snapchain
yeah that's correct
not not a fork
well it's a fork of their project like the it's in terms of git it's a fork in terms of like protocols limitation it's not a fork i i don't like the idea of forking protocols it generally doesn't work if you look at every single protocol in the industry that has ever been forked the fork does not survive it it always ends up with the the main shout
out nouns shout out shout out love to nouns on their forks
that that also kind of leads to an interesting like social commentary as well like these protocols they say that even the governance is decentralized but in reality like it does tend to stick to the core teams like the core teams don't ever seem to lose control
yeah it's definitely something that is a still a challenge for sure okay so let's move to core mobile is now available is it still beta do you still need can anyone use it or is it still by request to so is it still it's still in test flight yes no
it's still in test flight it's an open beta though somebody okay somebody registered farcaster.pro as a domain and they made it redirect to our test flight so if you just go to http farcaster.pro it will take you to the test flight and you can you can unplug yourself the and you don't
know who did that
no i have no idea who did that the that's funny 100 beta google's very strict with their with their play beta services like it's actually really hard to to onboard people with that like they don't allow all they don't even allow all email addresses like a lot of people who are in the queue are people who use protonmail and other privacy services and they won't let you enroll protonmail addresses for the for the google play beta so we do have we have a test flight we have the google play beta which allows up to only a 100 testers which is lame and we also have a standalone apk that we link to with every single release that we make so that people wanna side load quorum onto their android phone they can totally do so
oh that's cool that's really cool okay so what's next so you talked about like how this started with this idea of this decentralized discord it's kind of you know morphed a little bit what else are you thinking about that would build on top of qilibrium
i mean we're after it all like our our core mission is to secure every bit of traffic on the internet and so i know it's a big lofty ambitious goal and like it sounds insane but like you know it wasn't that long ago that when amazon came along with amazon web services and we're like hey why bother with like running your own equipment on racks just use s three to host your data just use lambda to discreetly invoke your functions you don't need to worry about servers it's serverless now well it's not really serverless but that's our marketing and their their initial barrier their their hurdle they had to get over was convincing people that they could be trusted with bnb host of their their data their services etcetera and they from a business standpoint they've seemingly done well to avoid most of the things that they could potentially have lost trust on minus whenever it's politically inconvenient and minus whenever they've had to hand over data due to subpoenas regardless of the like legality of the claims or the jurisdiction there's a lot of companies that for example like they they will not host on amazon because they know that if push comes to shove like they will have their servers seized by court order even if it doesn't apply to their jurisdiction they had to deal some they had to do some work with the gdpr compliance in europe but even then like if it's if it's a national security concern do you really think the us government won't be able to get servers from europe from amazon with as tight of a dealing that they have seems unlikely and so that that comes back around to like one of the the value propositions of crypto which is you know google's motto for a long time was don't be evil but crypto's motto is can't be evil and so when you design decentralized internet architecture in a way that is resilient to censorship that is resilient to compromises that is resilient to intrusion on the privacy of data you create what is the true can't be evil architecture for the internet and so while i do believe that like yes there's people that are going to be hosting on queue there's already people who have been building their experiments on our private betas of these services on queue we will have to go through that same growing pain we will have to like get past the hurdle that people have with the trust barrier regardless of whether the cryptography itself is sound you still have to get over the social trust barrier but i believe we will do that
amazing adrienne what else did you get
this has been incredible cassie i love
you're such a good teacher by the way you really so i thought that i didn't
oh sorry
when you were talking about that it's like you start you were starting there by by teaching you know doing these videos and and talking to and i was like i i feel that like i feel that experience in you as you explain this because i understood it which i always get a little nervous because i've sat in sessions with you and they're always really good and one of the ones that stands out in my mind was farcon venice when you talked about the history of the computer and just like where and it was so so good i just really enjoyed it and i feel like you just are really good about sort of tying things together in a way that makes a lot of sense so thank you thank you for that and i appreciate it
i i feel like cryptography gets a bad rap in in terms of being difficult to understand because one it's a lot of like advanced number theory lots of crazy mathematics but the thing is is that you really only have to communicate two things to make any cryptography understandable by anyone which is one at the end of the day this is adding and multiplying numbers it doesn't have to actually be that complicated if they're not implementing the cryptography themselves like yes there are security concerns yes there are things you have to be mindful of but if you're just describing how it actually works you don't have to worry so much about the the number theory involved and the other side is if you're not able to explain that in simple terms then you probably don't understand it enough to be coding it
clip that
stop coding it if you don't understand it i really no i'd really like i feel like i have a much better understanding than i than i did just you know thirty minutes ago so i really appreciate that adrienne what did we miss what else did you wanna ask cassie about before we before we wrap
i just the the quorum mobile app just kind of flooded the feed whenever it launched two weeks ago and i was so happy to see it and it really i think your reputation is so strong and you don't get it overnight clearly just hearing you talk about your story you it seem you you know your life's work of of eight years and i know you don't get people coming out of the feed praising you and immediately wanting to use quorum overnight and it's not an accident so congratulations
and yeah and professor and i just we we always love having you q m we like having you on and get updates and this has this has been great
yeah when you have like just feel free anytime we'd love having you back here to talk about what you're building because you're just so prolific in what you're doing and i just really appreciate you and love yes
we did talk about the q the name service
oh the name service yeah cool name service q and s
so q and s this comes back around to the the identity problem like on farcaster we have f names but f names are actually just a smart contract on op mainnet that if you obtain an f name you have paid the registration fee and that registration fee goes to merkle manufacturers account it doesn't go to something that directly relates to the protocol and our point of view is that like that's fine like there's nothing wrong with being a like intermediary manager of names but at the same time like f names aren't very composable yes like you could argue yes you can read the proofs from op mainnet in order to prove identity but the the proof basis of how those work is a very long complicated flow to actually prove that somebody owns a name on queue the way that we do things everything is provable with a very succinct statement it takes only 148 bytes of data to actually succinctly prove anything on the network but our idea is that you know these names don't need to be directly linked to a given social media platform it doesn't have to be just quorum it doesn't have to be farcaster it doesn't have to be any one thing this is something that can be universal and i also am very anti extraction i don't like rent i don't think that the idea of rent on a protocol is reasonable or sound and so our proposal with q name service was that on all q products like q ink products at least but anybody that we're partnered with that's building around this as well like they're using this as well any queue product if you have a queue name it should integrate fine it should be easy to support it should be a unique identifier that also preserves your privacy in the sense that any information that you're wanting to give like how do you contact me through you know encrypted messaging how do you pay me this is information that should be optional for disclosure and so with that same proof basis mechanism you're able to succinctly prove to somebody yes this is my this is my key in which you can pay me yes this is my key in which you can contact me but at the same time if i don't wanna give you that information the only thing you know is this name
that's great that's really good by the way yeah you have quite the q army out there yeah we got some got some big fans in the chat and that's yeah that's really cool i love the way you're thinking about this and it's what like in terms of like if people want to learn more get more involved they can obviously go to farcaster.pro and jump on from the quorum from the quorum side but what else like if they are interested in i don't know running a node or something along those lines is what what are some other opportunities for people to get more involved at on the larger quilibrium protocol level i guess is the question
so our protocol is at github.com/equilibriumnetworkslash,uh,monorepo i guess some things never never leave me like work at coinbase monorepo work at forecaster monorepo but that's that's the core protocol quorum is also open source we we don't believe in the idea of having anything that deals with keys not be open source that's not okay so quorum dash desktop for the for the web app and desktop app it's also able to be run through electron and then quorum dash mobile for the mobile app if you're wanting to work on the hypersnap amended snapchain client that's the hypersnap project quorum dash
is that right not quorum oops sorry dash dash sorry
but yeah like there's lots of ways to get involved by working on that if you want to build on q we have docs at docs.colibrium.com we do also have q console i i said yesterday and this is something that i know a lot of the people in the audience that are from the q community are going to harp on because i'm notorious for saying today and because life or other things get in the way like right now we're waiting for apple's approval for quora mobile for the update that has the wallet so i said yesterday would be today and now i'm still waiting for apple but through this week at the very least you will be seeing the updates to quora mobile you'll be seeing our aws compatible services the first of our offerings there's free tiers that are very generous we're happy to extend credits for people who are building and needing more support and more ability to test things out before they're willing to pay there's lots of different opportunities yeah q's discord is very helpful as well
q's discord okay
really powerful community there at discord.gg/equilibrium equilibrium obviously i've been and
is it quillibrium.forum did you say quillibrium.com as like the main site for
correct yeah
like okay okay great
amazing amazing amazing oh hi bias i didn't know that was you
we miss you
nice to see you we miss you but maybe he's but he's wandering around on quorum and and quillibrium so that's cool
alright anything else adrienne that we might have missed it's a lot i'm just so excited to see everything that's going on and i feel like so when vitalik posted about decentralized social and and his you know thinking thinking there today one of the i did tag you in the replies like i tagged you know i tagged a few of the other clients too but it seems to me like that would be his jam like he would like you know like you gotta check this out so i just tagged him and i tagged the channel because i wasn't sure exactly where else to to send him to but but i do think like you know in terms of the the culture and the the vibe it like really seems to seems to gel in that direction for him so hopefully we'll see more people checking it out alright adrianne sorry i didn't mean to cut you off
but oh
i didn't have anything oh
alright it's been amazing i'm so glad you were here sorry we had a little you know announcement interrupt this i i apologize honestly i just think it's
very funny i i kept replying to people who are saying oh when coinbase acquires farcaster and i'm like i don't think so i don't think so didn't have any info about it like i didn't the maynard news was a bit of a surprise to me as well but like i knew that if anything was gonna happen it certainly wasn't gonna be coinbase buying them
i didn't think so like i thought that at first and the more we talked about it i went you know what it's not gonna be them and i actually had commented a couple of times today on similar similar similar casts but it makes sense for it to be you know more of a basically a community takeover but not really you know a neymar takeover but i think congrats
but it didn't ruin it
purple purple didn't even get a chance to bid i well purple's i
love it purple's treasury is a little too small for that situation
they got about $3.30
yeah yeah not enough not quite enough but i'm really i think you know we'll hopefully have some more conversations on money but it also the thing that i was getting a little concerned about was like okay let's see what happens with the protocol because as i'm watching all like core mobile and and the d gen app and sofa and uno and all these different clients popping up that are really good zapper zapper's you wanna do trading go zapper's great like that are incorporating farcaster i was like i really i feel like they were just getting started and i didn't want them to get rugged so i'm glad i feel like okay that concern is sort of off the table for now and that makes me feel a little better you had a couple i know what i wanted to ask you you had a couple fips that you had put through did anything finalize with those or are they still sort of just hanging for now
yeah that's kind of the the tricky question so i know that they are doing the work necessary to add our hypersnap node into the consensus set
okay
that's good arguably like at this point now especially like nanar's acquiring farcaster i joked that because neynar and farcaster had such a tight relationship that there really was only one set of sequencers and they were all owned by farcaster in some way but now it really is like it's just it's one entity so assuming that they're still going to be moving forward on that i know that they were doing the work necessary to confirm that it was safe to bring in another validator into the set the way that we're going to be doing this is that once they bring us in our hypersnap node will be running as part of the validator set we don't break protocol like our our messages that apply to hypersnap only they operate on a separate channel they do not interfere with the messages that go on the regular protocol itself but the way that we are architecting this is so that other people can run hypersnap nodes and engage in that extra level of consensus for other data so as soon as they let that through great that's one fip at least partially solved and you know joining our pool of nodes is effectively being a huge set of validators that's adding to the pool the second one which is the opportunity for another curator i ran a meeting a couple weeks back with different people in the community that are building clients that are building mini apps that are building like ai integrations and stuff to get a good idea about how they want content to be curated if they want content to be curated and how this can be incorporated at some level at the protocol but i don't i don't think that any of that's gonna be landing on protocol anytime soon and especially now with this acquisition in in motion i i don't think that that's gonna happen
great initiative though and i appreciate you taking you know that that lead and and trying to bring people together to kinda get a better consensus at the larger protocol level so definitely a worthy a worthy effort for sure alright cassie thank you so much for being here we actually didn't we do a lightning round with her when we met at farcon i feel like we did did we not did we ask you about kiwis
no we did i can't remember now
i remember kiwis as a concept and and if our customers like you know i was like people eating it with a spoon
okay hold on i think we need to do it really quick then really quick let's do a quick turnaround and then we'll let you go
do a we'll just do a few
yeah
do the two boxes i guess we started with the kiwi so cassie when you eat a kiwi skin on or off
skin off i i'm i'm not willing to commit to the bit
football or soccer
neither if i have to choose you'd be soccer
what is the next country you wanna visit
i'm just a question canada at this point i don't know i'm kinda limited
okay
it's just a question you can you can you can make it up
you don't have to go
no constraints yet we're not booking you a flight beach or mountain
definitely beach
if you could bring one person living or dead to farcaster who would it
be articorm
that's a tough question i think the larry would be interesting
who's your favorite farcaster bot
favorite farcaster bot oh man i think that this is gonna be really lame but i think it's the health bot that borodouch made so long ago because all it ever does is every hour post something that's like straighten your back and that's it like it's just
was that the drink water was that the drink water one
i forgot about that one i totally forgot about that one
that was yeah yeah and border patrol did all this stuff that i think are still sometimes they're still active you just don't see it because yeah now they're
they're just not getting used but they're there yeah
if you could ban one type of cast forever what would it be
content coins
okay
enough said this is
this question is is sponsored by wake which direction do you face in the shower
toward the like toward the water or away
i do a full three sixty like i i don't face a given direction the whole time
okay okay
and if you were to write a book what would it be about
probably about the early days of bitcoin i think that there's a lot of things that haven't been said that i think people would be very interested to hear
would read
i would read that
i would read that
i would read that
i would love to sit here at your perspective and what i know would be some good research in there
alright last one what is the last thing you bought with crypto
last thing i bought with crypto was a q and s name not not in
the queue for us i had a feeling you were gonna say that
oh that's amazing cassie thank you so much for being here with us if you're not following cassie at cassie on all the places well cass on mars if you're on twitter but otherwise look for at cassie in the protocol in the farcaster universe and go check out quorum and check out quilibrium but very cool we really appreciate you taking the time today this has been amazing thank you
so much and if anyone wants a a q and s invite code to to get a free name for themselves just use me
oh there you go very cool amazing thanks so much and thank you to the q army that's been in the chat we appreciate you we're gonna do a quick little wrap up we're gonna let cassie go thank you so much cassie we'll see you around and thank you to the q army for for being here today i love you guys you guys are amazing and very protective of the amazing cassie and i love that so apologies that i got a little distracted for a minute but i appreciate you and i heard you so was trying to confirm and i i just have to double check but i i think
to to do he has not responded to me but i think we will have rich still on friday because i'm assuming he you know he knew that this was coming
even though we did as far as calendar
we we are on rich's calendar
for noon eastern friday
so i assume that he
will still be joining us maybe we can get join dan dan we're gonna maybe we can get dan to
join soon here yeah we're gonna try and get dan here so we will see you all on friday we will be here at 11:30am eastern to do a little bit of news and then we'll jump in with brish at noon anything else adrianne let's wrap and cassie if you're still in our green room hang out for a minute we'd love to just catch up real quick off screen anything else before we wrap adrienne
for today no
i think we i think
i gotta get working on my mini app i gotta get my mini app done
yes i gotta get working on mine alright we'll have a new new jamfarcaster mini app coming soon
alright everybody we will see you on the other side on friday and until then everyone bob wait what what
oh no never mind no no no i lied
i lied
i completely lied it's okay nothing to do with anything i yep alright say goodbye alright hang on
thanks for joining us for this episode of gm farcaster and thank you to all our partners and hyper sub supporters bringing this episode to you follow the gm farcaster channel for all the latest updates and add our mini app on farcaster and the base app until next time bye bye