Vibe Check with @dawufi ep7 :: @cameron - /seemore /lounge

%

i was like

no i don't think so i don't think i have i have anything that like i'm i'm not super into anything that i'm like i mean like i'm i'm not afraid to be like hey you know that's coming or you know we'll we'll we'll come on into a future one obviously like same same as kind of like normal human rules like i don't i don't expect any kind of like gotcha but like if there is i reserve the right to be like alright cool man fuck off but

i mean like i'm i'm kind of in a spot where i'm not i'm not really actually like explicitly trying to plug anything i just like talking to my smart friends and i like talking about farcaster and i like thinking about where the internet is gonna go and hopefully we can shape it a little bit but like you know if it like i'm not gonna like pause for like an act break and then like plug a thing it's it's just not it it's not how i authentically feel about like what's happening right now and so to the to the extent that i like can just like act my life that way i do

that's that's fair that's fair

yeah yeah

works for me

i appreciate that

i'm cameron i'm building cmore.tv which today looks like automated creator pages but is ultimately the last funnel a creator is ever gonna need we'll obviously talk more about that on the pod i got into farcaster by sneaking into it which happy to talk about too and i've basically like once i snuck in just like hid for a little bit and then realized no one was looking for me and just started hanging out and talking to people and participating where where it made sense

yeah so so back in 2022 which was i i'm not i think they actually launched farcaster in late twenty twenty one if i have my like timeline correct but in 2022 another caster named alex quan at ace of pearl fame he tweeted a link on twitter to sign up for farcaster when he wasn't supposed to like like period full stop dan asked him to take this link down after he posted it but i've been following alex because he had this project i think called like tiny rooms and it's like it was basically like pixel art kind of like a space that you can decorate and so i thought it was cool so i followed him he tweeted this thing out i was like oh crypto you know social all these things that i was like trying to to understand better at the time i was like that looks cool let me sign up and then in the like ten minutes that it was up i saw it i signed up and then it took it down i don't as far as i know never tweeted it out again and so like that was a you know we we talk about like farcaster and its interactions with users like at that time they didn't really have anything that they had intentionally done other than not make the sign up not public to stop people from signing up so like this was an like if if a bot got hold of it they would have made you know the first ten thousand fids but i but i got it i think it was like fid six seventeen and so like sub 1,000 forecasters like got in and then just kind of like okay no one's gonna kick me off and then like over the next few months started posting and and interacting and you know kinda snowballed from there

well it's it i'm doing the podcast thing where i wanna respond with that's an interesting question because like the the it was like explicitly framed as like who were you before this

and like that's a question i have no fucking clue about to be completely honest like i i kind of frame it as like some periods of my life i think about the life that i'm living as i'm living it a lot more than others other periods i just fucking like do do and execute and like that version of me is is informing how i think about myself when it's the time to think about myself more but like not explicitly happening in the moment but like what i did before hanging out on farcaster and kinda start up land and crypto land was i was in the army i was so i went to college went to the virginia military institute i'd actually grown up in cherokee county georgia if anyone's familiar with that it's not like super in the woods but like i kinda classify it as like the borderlands between atlanta and like the rest of georgia and anybody that's like been to the kennesaw marietta area in georgia like understands what i mean by that where like you you have atlanta which is like kind of a city like it's it's not like a new york kind of a city but it has its own kinda like city energy and then like once you drive forty five minutes outside of atlanta like you're you're in the country

yeah and and so like i kinda straddled the like okay you know some weekends i would you know go backpacking just fucking with the the the woodsy you know high school kids that i was friends with and then at other times i'd go to atlanta and enjoy like a like a hardcore show or something like that and so so grew up in atlanta went to the virginia military institute for my college studied physics and math commissioned into the army as an infantry dude so i did that for four years deployed to kuwait and afghanistan with my platoon back in twenty sixteen seventeen and then i taught leadership at the army's officer candidate school before getting out transitioned into getting my mba which is actually really fortunate because i thought i was gonna go do like math research or something but it it turns out no one wants to hire you to do math if you haven't done math for a while and so like the sequencing of getting out of the military is you have to request to get out in advance usually further ahead than like is reasonable for a a private sector career switch kind of thing so i like asked to get out in 2017 and then i was allowed to get out in 2018 and so like i basically asked to get out started to try to find jobs in the in you know the private sector and then i realized that like all of my plans were just not gonna work because i didn't understand how the world worked and then i kinda scrambled to be like oh shit what do veterans do when they get out of the military and turns out a lot of them go get like their mba or something like that because that's like an off ramp and that off ramp got me into kind of like tech into startups into just kind of like understanding the private sector in general and then from there after i graduated cofounded an ecommerce software startup sold that in late twenty twenty one and then that's kind of the transition to me finding farcaster

got i got cool math games just like locked in

right

yeah so for for anybody that doesn't know lounge i call it kind of like an asynchronous group chat and it it's an experiment on top of forecaster channels and so i wrote about forecaster channels back when they were like creating them for the first time in like even the the fully non decentralized way and i really like channels because they're kind of a confluence of a couple of different things on the internet all of which are really useful and i don't think has been attempted in its like in the form that channels on farcaster appear in but like quickly it's like a subreddit plus a telegram channel plus a discord to a degree where like you are solving some of the problems of these private mechanisms i e like distribution like you can't have great distribution of inherently private groups because the content that the group is making doesn't get shared with the rest of the world the flip side is like when all that matters is distribution on something like a tiktok you get like potentially mega virality but you like lose the depth of content and the like the when you require a user to bring some context to a piece of content there you like you have a lot more opportunity to create something like rich and rewarding and kind of like i don't know you call it a like a like a three standard deviation piece of content where like you can enjoy it so much more because you have some additional context that doesn't require like the slop to be accessible to like the the lowest common denominator some really broadly accessible content isn't slop but a lot of it is and like i mean there there's a reason why cat videos are like the primitive of like new places on the internet because like everybody likes cute animals for the most part part and so like lounge was a place where like hey channels like explicitly mean there's a place with people with higher context that you can do stuff in and i was hoping that that plus farcaster being like a higher context place to begin with and a higher like nuance tolerable place to begin with you might be able to have like a more interesting post than in other places the other thing that is really really important about channels and lounge is that like there's not that interesting stuff happening in a lot of channels because it's like work to make good content and like dan dan hits on this all the time but like making good stuff on the internet is hard and most people aren't gonna do it because they're not gonna spend the time to like get in the reps of making not good content to like learn how to make good stuff and so i thought there was maybe room for a place where people that i think could make interesting content can be like like shaped or like guided a little bit so that the things that they know that are interesting get showcased which is like the core of most like really good content it's like there's an earned secret or something that other people aren't aware of that like you can pull out of somebody and so like lounge is the place where i just get to ask my really smart friends like five ten 15 things and see what happens and it it has gotten you know a good amount of traction which is exciting it's really hard to tell what's like actually working on farcaster though but but that's like a whole separate thing

he's straight up just taken the top memes on twitter that he can find every day and posting them to forecaster like that's a % what's happening which is like what i would probably do in his situation too like honestly i'm surprised that we haven't seen larger larger scale automation of the best memes from twitter to farcaster from that team maybe we have and we just like haven't haven't clocked into it but like the the like rest of the internet needs the like simple narratives not not saying that the rest of the internet is dumber but like most people engage with the internet in like a a very unnuanced way and that's like fine right like the like haktoah being the story that anybody or the the meme that anybody can say and get a couple likes for free for a few days like those types of thing are what like that that movement is what makes the internet like feel like it's alive and feel like it's participatory for the majority of people that it's not really participatory you just get to like hop on and draft for a little bit with these like big meme trends but like yeah no i think i think that stuff doesn't originate on farcaster and unless it starts to originate on farcaster like it it doesn't have like a a super long shelf life i think

yeah so i mean i i actually think the last thing that you you were getting on to about like competing with merkel is probably something that's worth just sitting on for a second like like i i am not a silicon valley native i do not have parents that were like fang engineers like i do not have any inside baseball other than my two years at a global institution like that that is very much part of that pipeline and that kind of like surprised me right like i i showed up to harvard business school and i was just like oh cool i was losing at a game i didn't know i was playing cool that's just like my new baseline for the life for life

in in in some ways and so like i don't know anything more than other people in general about farcaster and engineers and building but like my kind of obsession over the past few years is like startups and how to be good at startups and how to make them work and you know kinda had like one what i would call like partial success and then one i'm gonna say not success yet but like working my ass off to try and make it with seymour

but like i don't think it's crazy to say that the merkel team is one of the best engineering teams in maybe the history of technology that now has effectively an unlimited budget to try what they want to do

just from a raw horsepower drive and focus perspective from the leadership team down to the engineers because like there's been great engineers in a spot like before and there's gonna be again there's been like great visionary people in one spot like this what are they up to now like fourteen fifteen like world class engineers on their fucking team

yeah and so like it's crazy to think that anything that's in there like with their with their self constrained ballpark of relevant things to do it's crazy to think you're gonna beat them like maybe you could have a year and a half ago with like your hyper team of you you know seal team six engineers but like after they get a hundred 50,000,000 more dollars no way not yet and like money isn't everything but it's like a lot of things

yeah and so like from that perspective i think anything that is like a passing interest from the warpcast team i'm not saying is a is like a straight nonstarter but it's like a very gives me a big old uh-oh feeling as somebody that like you know like doesn't have unlimited resources time or ability to like make something and hopefully carve out a slice of the economy that like i can run them a like a a company in so like that's just kind of like a a scary thing more power to people that wanna try to do that i think best case you're you're building an smb which is not a bad thing at all but like a small to medium sized business can be ran by like a team of three four five to like a healthy scale and like i don't know i just don't see how anybody that like starts getting some traction that way that is like real like not completely orthogonal to work cast like of course they should like integrate that feature as soon as they let somebody else build out some traction for it

and david's real

there's there's like a there's like a really interesting i mean like this isn't this isn't new in terms of like tech models but like

like bottom bottoms up disruption is like very much chasing things that aren't worth in this case like warp casts time to chase mhmm but the problem is is like if you are chasing these things that aren't small enough you prob or that that aren't big enough for them to care about but you know in your head like oh but the tam is ultimately this which is my justification for working on it like that sucks because as soon as it starts showing that oh that tam is actually on the on the arc of this growth path then it does become a big enough opportunity for like a merkle whatever platform you're you're really trying to like disrupt like it makes sense for them to chase after it and so like none of this is said with any maliciousness on my part it's like super reasonable

but it's really really hard for me until we have actual examples of it working for a long period of time like i don't see why a merkle growth arc doesn't look like a microsoft late nineties like desktop as the like the os as the distribution like boot on the neck or the apple app store iphone boot on the neck like i don't i don't see that and like that's maybe aggressive language for a team that is still like in their very very early days that have mostly done what they have said in terms of like public good but like the tape plays out the way that it plays out and until it shifts from like the don't be evil to a can't be evil somehow like i'm i'm just you know i eyes wide open

no no major backlash from people that that could really be annoying i think

one of

it's like %

yeah like i i think i think like in conjunction with that because like i don't disagree with any of it and like anything that i say is like very much in the vein of like i'm making a huge bet on farcaster as like a platform and a future platform and just kind of like the vibes of it is where i want to be on the internet it's it's also super clear that like farcaster has entered the level or like the the like ring of success where no matter what they do it can't be the thing that everybody wants and so like most of the complaints i would say as of permissionless but like really the last six months like they they were they're never gonna get a % approval rating and in fact if they're like targeting that i think it's super misguided and i don't think that they are right like there's there's a there's a thoughtful element of them of like intentionally stirring the pot when they like need to or they wanna like pump a a a feature release and then there's like just the part of hey many of the people that are upset about things are either coming in from like a no context background or like a specific that like they've already decided how they want the world to be and that's explicitly not what warpcast at least like maybe the farcaster protocol might be but like warpcast has repeatedly and publicly stated that they are not going to be and so this isn't going to feel like the utopia that some people may have been sold because it is an explicitly opinionated thing that does things that they think will ultimately let it survive as opposed to following some ideology

of yeah no

yeah like it i mean it's super clear like dan doesn't listen to most of the replies right like because first of all who knows what's astroturfed anymore just like in general and i'm not like a like a post truther kinda dude i just like from repeated reps of like trying to earnestly deal with the internet like no just a lot of it is legitimately in the realm of like a straight up nation state actor who's trying to do something some just person that you probably wouldn't give the time of day because like you can very clearly tell from meeting them irl that you wouldn't really value their opinion but you like don't have that like there there's a layer of like plausible oh this might be real in any like post that you come across unless you explicitly don't take that or third it could be like a literal child that has a computer and like you know not saying that children can't have good opinions but like the amount of energy i've seen creators waste in the comment section on like tiktok because some you know some literal 12 year old is saying that you know like their protest song is stupid or whatever yeah you know it's the the internet is is random and a lot of the time signal less and it's really really hard to like do useful things while using the internet as your signal loop

yeah i mean like so i i found the debate on farcaster about like what what's a bot account what's not to be really interesting like it's it's honestly kind of like a litmus test of like what's your opinion about the internet in general right and like what's your experience to be completely honest because like if you if you didn't grow up with an internet that wasn't bought into shit or at least was bought into a very different way then you i don't know you just kind of like experience the internet i think a little bit differently because like a lot of a lot of the things that i see and i'm like okay this is this is just like this like i saw in the early days of like irc or like parts of four chan or like bodybuilding.com like forums and so like the well i'll i'll call them like proto behaviors of like trolling and like memetically remixing things and like what is an earnest reply versus a troll reply is very much informed from like growing up as a weird internet kid playing online games and like like doing all of that from a place of like me being kind of the bad actor on the internet because like as a kid you you just do dumb shit right like i i used to play halo halo one online with some buddies and we would pretend we were colorblind in the chat so that we would just team kill our own team and they wouldn't ban us like like dumb shit like that

and so like i i don't know i come i come to the internet from this hey it's by default adversarial because like you don't have any of this like skin in the game that you do when somebody can punch you in the face in real life

and like everything on farcaster like once there were actual real world incentives for like status and money of course the replies are gonna get powdered to shit of course there's some sort of arbitrage that an actor that it will spin up a server to put a bot or like just be themselves you know because they think it's gonna be of some value to them like of course that was gonna happen in my head but like that doesn't feel like that was the default assumption for a lot of people and i think that like that's informing a lot of the responses to like merkel's mechanisms to it

yeah yeah like i i think that it's like really easy to moralize this when like the reality is is like a lot everyone has different lives and there's a bunch of bunch of stuff going on that like isn't isn't like either directly relevant or like isn't actually replicatable for you or any other individual

yeah yeah

yeah i think that they're like there there's a really i don't know if it i'll i'll call it good but there's a really memorable tyler the creator tweet about cyberbullying and he's just like basically like how is cyberbullying real just like put your phone down and walk away and and and like i part of me is sympathetic to that but like a part of it is like we do have legit scientists that are working together to try and like capture your attention like there's a global arms race to manipulate you to keep looking at whatever you're looking at on your magic rectangle and like even if the merkel team doesn't do it or the seymour team doesn't explicitly do the the worst things like they're still informed by twenty plus years plus another hundred years of like actual advertising like study and so like i'm sympathetic to like people caught in the black hole you know whirlpool of algorithmic feeds but they also like as you point out like they show you what you are kind of manifesting

which which is like also an interesting like i think there's there's a rabbit hole to to pull i i didn't plan on saying this but like the rise of people genuinely believing they can manifest things in conjunction with how algorithmic feeds basically are the manifestation of what we're trying to do i think that there's like an interesting screenshot essay or blah like podcast conversation to have there but like i think i find honestly i find myself like trying to just turn off the internet in my brain the more that i like do the internet i don't know professionally is i guess what i would call it and so like i'm finding i do more full dark periods where like my phone isn't even in the same room as me just because like i hyper concentrate so much on like my work guest feed or like the twitter feed to see what the what is happening there or whatever or tiktok and the fact that like you get into such a groove and being locked in on like kind of studying the content makes it so that it's like really really easy to do that at the expense of everything else and so like in the theme of people complaining about their feeds or whatever like honestly i just don't have time to even think about those people anymore so it's like a default hey we're not interacting on the internet for the most part anymore because like there are things that i wanna do on the internet i know i can't do everything and i certainly don't wanna like commiserate real time forever because i just fuck that's a nightmare

i'll call you for tips

yeah so i i've been i'm in like a weird spot with seymour in general because like on the one hand you have this like ship early ship often ship before you're comfortable kind of like ethos in building shit but the reality is with some like products it has to be a level of like quality before it's like actually useful to a person and so most early stage startups like do get 10 of their friends to use their product mostly out of like the the founder being like hey please use my product i know it sucks and so like you know some some products like are have the the fortune of like doing something actually better than the original thing at first but most things get there eventually as opposed to like born fully formed right like this isn't an electrical generator that we're making for the first time like this is this is like no joke how do we improve a thing that has been around for a decade which is like a link in bio page and so with seymour i initially really really thought that the approach vector for people was gonna be like hey this isn't a link in bio this is its own separate thing where like you send people here it has all your content it's always up to date blah blah blah and that's the foundation for kind of like doing a bunch of new things with your content that you have in in this one spot it became super super apparent that like that's too much nuance and i i think as a growth person you'll appreciate that like there there's too much nuance in explaining why you're different than every existing link in bio thing that exists out there to the point that like you don't really have a license for anybody's attention until you do the thing that already exists out there and do it so much better than these other things that it's like no question why you would use this thing but linkin bio is like arguably the worst place to build a company because it is super saturated it's effectively commodity software which is just like a wall of of buttons so like javascript on a freaking page somehow and the people that you're selling it to i e creators don't really think about it in the way that i think they need to be thinking about it which is as part of how they get people on the internet to do what they want them to do and so for creator that's typically growing subscribers or earning more money and like those those are the things that creators generally care about and so like we've basically took the last like month or so because it it we tried a lot of different ways of selling like hey like all your content in one spot zero effort like this just works kinda thing and when i'm pitching it it kind of works because like i can talk to people and i can answer the questions as i'm doing it but when they just interact with it it is very very hard to like understand that this is like a different thing than a link in bio in general yeah and so we've we've kinda been like quiet for six weeks posting teasers but we're basically like revamping how this thing works right right now link in bio is basically like a wall of links a creator will like make it at some point they'll put in all the things that they can think of it's 15 links and then like within a week it's already out of date because they posted new content or they started a new channel or whatever and so like from there we realized that we can take all of this content that people have we can effectively make what i'm calling like a a creator client for that person like basically a mini app on a web page that i think now can be the fastest way to go from zero to a hundred on a new creator that you just found and all of this is in pursuit of making this thing which i think is the keystone for creators digital funnels which is this link in bio which is the one place all of your socials can point back to but just making it like inherently smarter prettier and more useful to people that are discovering you for the first time and then from there it's it's basically like anything one of our users wants us to do with this kind of page that fits in the vision of helping creators make more money or grow subscribers is probably something that is either already in our road map or is gonna go in our road map but it's like we are attacking this link in bio keystone step in every creator's like funnel trying to make that as useful and as intelligent and as smart and flexible as possible and as rich as possible and then from there trying to make all of the revenue sources that creators typically have because there's like seven or eight that most creators typically follow over the course of their creator career because they all make money in the same way and then just adding those like one at a time and suggesting them at the right time for the creator so it becomes much more of like an os for a creator that is like centered around this keystone part of their funnel as opposed to like yeah it's my link in bio i set it up six months ago and i haven't updated it since like which is the revealed behavior for creators

have to

yeah like i think so i think that there's like a couple different important threads in there like one of the first one being the more people like a creator the more that they want to exist in a space that it feels like for them and their fandom like that's something that you kind of see in a lot of different places that like apps are like trending towards like youtube is trying to generate like more stuff within the profile with like posts from the creator in the community like

tiktok is trying to increase video length because they know that most of their creators like really don't have a relationship with the the the fan the fan has a relationship to the bit not to the creator yeah and so like for anybody that wants to do this long term you have to have some sort of group of people that like genuinely like you and wanna interact with you and like other stuff related to you and the closest the closest thing we have to those spaces right now are are basically like micro pay walled gardens like like the patreons of the world and i don't think that that's like the right shape for most creators either like the distribution is already hard putting your best stuff behind payment gates is like inherently self limiting and in a like in a hits driven internet it's like even more you know painful to do that and so like i think that there needs to be a space that isn't just like it it it's honestly kinda like channels where

have aspects of it that are like explicitly distributive but also aspects of it where you can retreat into we'll call it a cozy corner but like i really think you can call it a like a like a like a like a community corner where just like you would log in in the mid two thousands to like the doctor who forums or like a little bit later than that like the tumblr pages for these different fandoms like i don't think fandom is explicitly what we're going for but there's not a place that isn't i'll i'll call it like

absolutely fucking destroyed by ads on the internet yeah like any anywhere where there's like a little bit of a fandom you're just getting like banner added to shit right now and like i think that there is a different place that you can have where like you have good content you have creators not like basically not doing most of the admin work of organizing it into a coherent narrative but if they do want to do the admin work of being like hey somebody gets to my see more page i know that i have a series of you know youtube shorts that are like pretty funny to watch in this specific order like having that little mini client where you can like be like hey this is the first kind of like vein of content a new person wants to see for or like generally wants to see for me like we'll put that like right up front or above the fold like conversely like most creators don't really think about that like they you know if they're really good at bits they're gonna do the bits but like what i can do is like i know a user's coming from linkedin i know you a user's coming from youtube or these other places i can change around how the the the like client is gonna render for that person because i know that they're like a a short form video enjoy or something like that or more likely to be that and so a client that is already doing the world class like ab testing like like funnel testing that like tech startups are doing i think it's just kind of a no brainer with individual creators' content like if you just empower the creators to increase their conversion rates on the things that they're already trying to do or suggest things that like would benefit them like i think it's a lot more likely we build an actual middle class in the creator economy where like yeah you can get thirty forty 50 thousand followers on your sailing knot videos and earn a sustainable living or at least like only have to work 10 a week instead of the like forty that they're doing now or sixty or whatever

think such a

yeah if if things go right with seymour like we're gonna be the best position to bring every creator's content on chain because we should be able to port everything from their youtube account onto farcaster

i mean i honestly i think and my last startup was in kind of like old to new media right like media publishers i think

i i just think most people in ads are really bad at understanding how ads work and if they work and i think like marketers not demanding attribution in some way shape or form or at least trying to track it informs a lot of like the really i don't know bullshitty ad stuff that happens out there the other big so like i think broadly like many marketers are much more vibes marketers than like data driven which isn't inherently bad but like basically means a lot of money is wasted period full stop just like not being useful productive capital but the flip side of it is the the shittiest actors in any advertising ecosystem always have the most margin to play with

yeah and so like if you have the most margin to play with because you're like selling sawdust which is like a % margin because you're not actually paying for anything useful basically like of course those ads are gonna be everywhere because they just have the most money to spend with it and so like i kinda see those two things being broadly how most like banner ad ecosystems play out the third thing which i just think is like really undercounted as like a real and meaningful force impacting like mostly young people but like people in general the idea of creator product fit is so much more important than anybody realizes because we have never like you can kind of say that companies have an incentive to not sell shitty things but the fact that like a company is multiple layers removed from a human being feeling something when things go bad for the most part like the cmo might get stressed but like the person working at a company that just sold garbage like unless it's like actively harmful and they're getting you know attacked by their family for it or whatever like it's it's so much more

it's like casey neistat camera videos are i think the best videos on the internet for like deciding if you wanna buy a new thing because the dude has been touching cameras longer than most people have been one making content but two like been alive and like the fact that he can speak to it from an informed like expert perspective and make it entertaining and make it valuable like it's a combination of all of the things that make him a uniquely like impressive creator oriented around an authentic recommendation about a thing and like there's nobody on farcaster doing that right now because the incentive doesn't exist for that to to happen right now like the payoff for them to put in the work to share their expert opinion for the most part doesn't play out and so like like i think what we will see for things that wanna be like enduring successes they focus basically on creator product fit for advertising and like that's maybe the most important thing that they do for their go to market

or it started like the company explicitly has started by that creator slash entrepreneur

yeah i can see that like i think i think there's a version of it that like i mean i think everything in crypto is just like a like a hyper like a high velocity version of the thing that it would have been without crypto and so like the the scammers are gonna scam more because like if we're talking about this infinite margin like world well like that's what a shit coin is is it is an infinite margin good because there for most of it there's nothing underneath it other than like trying to temporarily price attention which means that they can spend as much as they can get away with on advertising the thing in this like self referential mimetic spiral up up and then back down but the piece of like once we make this like world legible like the zacks zacks xbts of the world are doing like it's really really interesting because like on the one hand we do have in cassie's kind of like framing this zero privacy dystopia

and that which like i actually think is super fair but on the other hand like we might have a chance to like frankly have a better model than this like ftc standoff that we have with creators where they're supposed to tweet hashtag ad in any of the ads but like no one really meaningfully does

and so like having a way to make kind of the incentive structures more legible via like public ledgers i think is really really powerful

i think it's always a continuum because like obviously if you wanna scam people you just pay cash off chain still

but like you know there there are parts of it that you can't can't do that with or you can't easily do that with which is like often good enough for the situation which is which is i'm okay with like

i mean i i

well so maybe i don't i don't know if you agree with this but like we're talking about people that believe in utopia at the beginning of the call and like i i kind of equate the the problem with believing in a utopia isn't the fact that you you believe that things can be good it's that you believe that things can stay the same and so like i kind of view like what people are really saying when they're like i believe in utopia i believe in a dystopia or whatever whatever like their end state belief is like they're really saying that they believe in stasis which like i don't really believe is a thing for any meaningful amount of time which is like existentially really hard to believe because like when you're feeling good you're like oh wow cool this is temporary and fleeting but like the flip also works when you're like having a slow morning like i had today or like a shitty day or whatever like you're like oh this is also a temporary state of the world and so like i think a lot of things haven't meaningfully changed in that respect we just can either get to the end state faster and then change it just as fast

likewise man

yeah follow slash see more if you haven't yet we'll be we'll be dropping a lot of things in there including soon some interesting content from from our content creators also keep an eye out on season three of lounge we've done startup or software founders we've done channel owners and the next one is gonna be design oriented tag me if you think someone who's good at design should be part of the discussion i'm gonna be chasing the usual suspects and hopefully some unusual ones as well to get them to to hang out for a week or so oh the the quick learning from lounge because we never really talked about that is like everyone's busy everybody gets bored tightening the shot group of like hey we're gonna do this for seven days and we're gonna do it really really well for seven days is the next experiment i'm gonna try because like if you have too many people everyone like tragedy of the commons like everybody gets away with not posting if they want to which is fine like i i didn't have any hard rules about it but it's like really hard to manage and keep the momentum if you do stuff for too long and so i'll plug a nice tight focused lounge about design soon and then i'll plug vibecheck with woof this is a great time if you're thinking about going on it and he asks you you should come on

man have a good one